I was referring to spaying of females - but yes, you have the right of it across the board.
Not sure if Basenji or mutt...
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Additional pictures would be helpful. We have a number of members that would be able to visually look at the pups structure and give an "educated guess". For instance: Basenji's have a square appearance, related to the length of their legs in relation to their backs, as well as other traits. You can learn more at the AKC website. Just bear in mind, it would only be a guess. The only way to be certain about your pups heritage will be through a DNA test. (Lots of companies seem to offer them, prices vary.)
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Could be a Basenji. If not no problem. He's super adorable no matter what. I can see why you scooped him up. The younger the pup the harder it is to tell. When first born they all look like mole rats! LOL The different shapes and sizes take longer to emerge.
Please don't neuter him. Too young and neutering isn't healthy. In fact there probably isn't any point in neutering him ever. Of course where you live may be different, but where I am dogs do not run free and the idea of needing to spay/neuter is a cultural artifact from a bygone era. I've never heard of an "unwanted" mating. Those seem to be the province of breeders.
In fact some people are just whacky. I've had people tell me I need to be careful because their dog isn't neutered, as if dogs were like people and you could have a mating when the female isn't in season.
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Great round eyes..not quite basenji, but dark spots on skin very very common. Soooo very, very handsome. We will all be happy to watch this guy grow. Neuter...ehhhh...maybe not at his tender age. Let him mature for at least a year, then if you still want to ....Well it is your decision after all, but let him get his full body style and musculature. Happy days to you all.
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A Basenji mix is a wonderful way to ease into the breed. Your pup has enough "look" to be a Fauxsenji aka Beautiful Blend. We have one, Roxy, same color as yours. We took her in at about 7 months because she had no bite inhibition. We got the biting under control and Roxy is a beloved member of the family. She is also great company to our remaining Basenji who is 15 and nearly blind.
Your pup is darling...enjoy!
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Sorry in advance for the long post... my account is still "baby" status, so I can't post quickly, and I want to respond to each of you! Pics below!
@marcus Yeah, agreed! I know his breed doesn't technically matter (we're going to love him regardless), but it's still a fun exercise!
@elbrant I'm going to TRY... I prefer to upload directly to the post, but if that doesn't work, I'll link to a google drive folder with some pics if you guys are interested. I think I want to leave the mystery intact for a bit... we may try the DNA testing at some point in the future, if we get enough positive feedback on the potential for him being a Basenji from you guys, I guess... I looked up the AKC breed standard, and I think he has an almost box body (a bit long, I think?), but again, he's still a puppy, so I wasn't sure.
@DonC He's definitely super adorable! Sweet as can be, too, which is part of why I think he may not be Basenji... I've heard they have very inquisitive and assertive temperaments, which Copper only seems to exhibit shortly after he wakes up from a good sleep. His size is basically perfect for a Basenji, based on what I have been able to find online (estimated to be 13 weeks tomorrow, and weighs 10 pounds).
I've never heard the strong arguments for NOT spaying/neutering a dog... Could you please help me out with this? I've always heard vets and animal rights activists claim that is the most humane thing to do for animal growth control. I don't think I have a problem with keeping him natural, but I was trying to do some basic stuff that I figured was pretty normal. If I had solid scientific evidence to stand on, I'd never "fix" another animal again.
@joan-duszka Ah, are Basenji's supposed to have almond shaped eyes? If so, maybe the pictures at the bottom of this post will be more indicative for telling that trait... I'd like to see the scientific (non-activist) research on "fixing" pets. If you have a down-to-earth resource, that would be fantastic!
@MrsCastro OMG! If that's how Copper ends up looking, my wife will be super happy! She hasn't been aware of the Basenji breed before this, and she is now fascinated and hopes he turns out to have primarily Basenji traits.
Here's some updated pics... He's tough to keep still! He just woke up from his nap...
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Copper is beautiful - doesn’t matter what he is - he’s ADORABLE! He appears to be part basenji to me - especially his face, tail, and coat.
Congratulations on your new pup!!
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@kembe Thanks, Kembe! We agree... Super thankful we were able to save him from spending a single moment inside animal control!
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He's adorable!
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Re: neutering. We know more about this than we used to. While more of a problem in large dogs, bone cancer is a concern with neutering. Especially early neutering. You might want to hold off a bit and discuss with your vet. The risk of other cancers such as of the urinary bladder, cutaneous mast cell tumors and hemangiosarcomas may also be higher in neutered dogs. There is some good information here.
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Copper is SO adorable! I love the last photo of him just sitting. He is so stinkin' cute. Regardless if he is a basenji or a
basenji mix.............at this point, does it really matter? He looks basenji to me, but not a purebred. The only way to know for sure to to do one of those DNA tests. Enjoy him. He looks like he is going to be a whole lot of fun to have around.
As for neutering, some vets usually say 6 months, some will do earlier (I don't recommend that). Like the other's have said, I would hold off on that till he is at least a year or so. Do research on that. Intact male dogs have a tendency to "mark" their territory, and fight with other male dogs. You would want to socialize him as much as possible to other dogs and people once he is done with all his vaccines (usually around the 4 month mark). Play with him and tire him out as much as possible. A quiet basenji is something to be concerned about (what is he into, what's he doing....etc). A tired basenji is a good basenji.............they don't get into trouble.......chewing, etc. Would love to see him grow into the beautiful dog I believe he will be. Hope you keep us all posted on Copper. -
@eeeefarm yeah, I did a bit of research and I’m already convinced. Unfortunately, because we rescued him from a animal control, we signed an agreement that we would have him sterilized. I’m going to try to ask if we can just do something like a vasectomy instead of fully neutering.
We may be able to get away without doing any of it if this virus situation continues... but if not, I’m at least going to practically beg them to let it wait til he is much more mature.
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@basenjimom2 Thank you so much! (as if I had anything at all to do with his cuteness... lol)
Yeah, he should be super fun! He's already a great puppy, and doesn't have much of an issue with responding well to our leadership, even with our 4 (somewhat) young children.
I'm hoping we won't have to neuter him, but because he was a rescue from animal control, it was part of the agreement (I didn't know that until this evening).
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@eledhan said in Not sure if Basenji or mutt...:
it was part of the agreement
Read your adoption contract carefully and make sure you understand what you agreed to. The portion referencing pet nueter/spay agreement may have a specific timeline. Or, it may not. Make sure you find out.
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He's adorable and imo, has lots of basenji in him.
I can just see him doing the 'basenji 500!' Hopefully you are already witnessing him all of a sudden getting a burst of energy and running around crazy - the basenji 500!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjydJUzRV54
that's just one pup doing the basenji 500 - if you type in basenji 550 on the youtube site, there are quite a few other examples.
Enjoy him!
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@eledhan said in Not sure if Basenji or mutt...:
@DonC He's definitely super adorable! Sweet as can be, too, which is part of why I think he may not be Basenji... I've heard they have very inquisitive and assertive temperaments, which Copper only seems to exhibit shortly after he wakes up from a good sleep. His size is basically perfect for a Basenji, based on what I have been able to find online (estimated to be 13 weeks tomorrow, and weighs 10 pounds).
He is definitely super cute. Really. Looks more like a Basenji than a lot of Basenjis! LOL Just a FYI, the ears often don't come up until later, and then it's a process. Sometimes they go up and then come down before going up the final time. Also note how getting eye level gives you a much better shot.
As for the downside of spay/neuter, there is a ton of info. This is one of the better seminal studies: https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0055937 But you can find a lot more. I think there is even a book on the subject.
Given the current situation I wouldn't worry about spay/neuter. You likely can't do it now -- my vet has quite a protocol in place and not doing anything elective. By the time they get back you will have been forgotten. FWIW there is an article in The NY Times that goes over the fact that spay/neuter has not decreased the number of unwanted pets. The decrease occurred in the 40s, 50s, and 60s before spay/neuter became a thing. Since then the rate has been constant.
Here is also an interesting fact you might want to share with your wife: While most breeds share a lot of DNA with all other breeds, Basenjis share very little. The three breeds that have Basenji in them are Rhodesian Ridgebacks, Azawakhs, and Rat Terriers. The first two make sense since they are African hunting dogs, and the Basenji is definitely that. The Rat Terrier likely because Rat Terrier breeders wanted stronger prey drive, and Basenjis provided this. (Rat terriers have been more a function over form breed so their breeders have been open to breeding with other breeds).
Enjoy your pup!
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Mostly Decker Terriers as Basenjis were used in their breeding programs in years past... not so for Ridgebacks or Azawakhs.. at least not in my opinion...
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@marcus said in Not sure if Basenji or mutt...:
Mostly Decker Terriers as Basenjis were used in their breeding programs in years past... not so for Ridgebacks or Azawakhs.. at least not in my opinion...
Isn't a Decker Terrier a Decker Rat Terrier? LOL
As for the shared DNA with Rhodesian Ridgebacks and Azawahks, according to DNA testing that's fact not opinion. Not sure why you would think this odd given those breeds are in close geographic proximity to Basenjis.
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@donc said in Not sure if Basenji or mutt...:
Azawahks
I've never heard of this breed. Very interesting ... thank you for sharing your knowledge!
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@elbrant - best that you go to AKC and research this breed it is spelled Azawakh
..https://www.akc.org/dog-breeds/azawakh/ This is a newly breed accepted by AKC to the hound group -
@donc - DNA those breeds Ridgebacks/Azawakhs are not typically in the Basenji... yes they are hounds and came from Africia but not found in Basenjis DNA that I have seen... but Decker Terriers are Rat Terriers and Basenjis were used in the development of Deckers and of course Deckers were used in the development of Rat Terriers.... if you research Basenji pedigrees you will not find Ridgeback or Azawah
