For Sale/Waiting List Post Rules: Read First

[Quercus]

@noodle:

Please could you tell me why you do not allow posts in your 'For Sale' forum from outside the US/Canada.
Thanks.

This is the most recent post that brought this thread to the surface again…I didn't want it to get lost, because I think it is a good question; particularly since we have more and more Basenji people from Europe.

[Rita Jean]

I did not say just breeders what I said was breeders AND OR backyard breeders would do there job when people get there puppy they would not have to worry. With having been said what some of you may seem to think are backyard breeders might be yes but no one is 100 % correct all of the time. So to tell me that 100% of the time that pet stores ONLY EVER get puppies for backyard breeder. Now should one of those puppies come from a good breeder but bought at store and there is something wrong with it ANSWER this 100 % your sure they would own up to it.

It's not Just backyard breeders and I HATE them more than most but I have done my share on rescue and still our family does there share on rescue mostly akita's but done pom's and rott's.

I am not angry at any poster way sharronhurlbut came back. No one is perfect and there are all walks of life. I wish all aniamls never had health problems and every body could tell the TRUTH but we all know what a wish is.

Rita Jean

[tanza]

@Rita:

I did not say just breeders what I said was breeders AND OR backyard breeders would do there job when people get there puppy they would not have to worry. With having been said what some of you may seem to think are backyard breeders might be yes but no one is 100 % correct all of the time. So to tell me that 100% of the time that pet stores ONLY EVER get puppies for backyard breeder. Now should one of those puppies come from a good breeder but bought at store and there is something wrong with it ANSWER this 100 % your sure they would own up to it.

It's not Just backyard breeders and I HATE them more than most but I have done my share on rescue and still our family does there share on rescue mostly akita's but done pom's and rott's.

I am not angry at any poster way sharronhurlbut came back. No one is perfect and there are all walks of life. I wish all aniamls never had health problems and every body could tell the TRUTH but we all know what a wish is.

Rita Jean

Pet stores get puppies from puppy brokers who get them from puppy mills, with the sometimes Mom/Pop pet store might get them from a Backyard Breeder. I can say without a doubt that there is no "Basenji" the comes from a responsible breeder that has ever sold a puppy to a pet store. If they did, they are no longer a responsible breeder, period. And I will stand a support that statement to anyone, anytime.

And pet stores are a small part of the problem now days… most of the BYB's are selling over the internet, they don't need that 3rd party outlet... takes away from the profit.

[Rita Jean]

Pat I understand but it seems and I say again seems like to some on here that there are only certain breeders that are any good and eveyone else is nothing. I can tell you were I got my first akita was a breeder and yes some went to brokers and stores. I was at the breeder and I can only hope and wish that some day I have a home that is as clean as her kennel. You did not even go in without cover over your head and covers on your shoes. Now tell me because she sold to brokers or stores is she no longer any good.

So just maybe and I say maybe if more responsible breeders help not sold help pet stores maybe can stop a little of the problems. Are you saying that any one that sells over the internet is no good?

Example person get's two B's and in a year or two has puppies. Has done the Fanconi and what ever test they can do for there age and test the puppies tells new owner all they know and can they are no good. They are not really big breeder but still breeder they are no good is this what you are saying.

[tanza]

@Rita:

Pat I understand but it seems and I say again seems like to some on here that there are only certain breeders that are any good and eveyone else is nothing. I can tell you were I got my first akita was a breeder and yes some went to brokers and stores. I was at the breeder and I can only hope and wish that some day I have a home that is as clean as her kennel. You did not even go in without cover over your head and covers on your shoes. Now tell me because she sold to brokers or stores is she no longer any good.

So just maybe and I say maybe if more responsible breeders help not sold help pet stores maybe can stop a little of the problems. Are you saying that any one that sells over the internet is no good?

Example person get's two B's and in a year or two has puppies. Has done the Fanconi and what ever test they can do for there age and test the puppies tells new owner all they know and can they are no good. They are not really big breeder but still breeder they are no good is this what you are saying.

Sorry… there is no responsible breeder that would place puppies in a pet store... no way .... sorry... and I am saying that 90% of people that sell over the internet are NOT responsible breeder.. there are a few breeders that put ads on the internet to try and go against the BYB's..... and hope that they read, learn, understand how to find a responsible breeder.... and honestly.. if they are responsible ... they don't need to put puppies on the internet.. they have reservations list for any litters they are planning.

[lvoss]

A responsible breeder by definition is responsible for the puppies they produce for their entire lives that means taking on the responsibility of screening homes and taking back those pups at any age for any reason for their entire lives. The minute a person sells a puppy to a broker or pet store they can no longer meet this definition. They have no idea where that puppy will end up nor do they care.

[JazzysMom]

@noodle:

Please could you tell me why you do not allow posts in your 'For Sale' forum from outside the US/Canada.
Thanks.

Good point Andrea… let's keep the question of the day at the forefront so hopefully an answer can be presented.

[lvoss]

@noodle:

Please could you tell me why you do not allow posts in your 'For Sale' forum from outside the US/Canada.
Thanks.

Though it is against the forum rule to post "For Sale" ads from outside the US/Canada, breeders are allowed to announce their breeding plans or litter births in the Breeding section.

[sharronhurlbut]

Also, quality breeders do their breeding to improve the breed they love.
They don't do it for $$ or because the have a male and female.
As posted on other areas, quality breeders usually make NO $$ on the pups…

[Basenjimamma]

Back to the for sale outside of the states question…if for instance our European members post their litters for sale, why would that be against the rules? I guess they would be aiming for european buyers? or is it common for buyers from here to get their B's in Europe and have them sent over here via plane? It seems a very long trip for a dog, I know I hate those cross atlantic trips with a passion and we do them yearly.

[thunderbird8588]

I too wonder why it is against forum rules for breeders to post litters for sale from other countries?

[africanbasenji]

@tanza:

Sorry… there is no responsible breeder that would place puppies in a pet store... no way .... sorry... and I am saying that 90% of people that sell over the internet are NOT responsible breeder.. there are a few breeders that put ads on the internet to try and go against the BYB's..... and hope that they read, learn, understand how to find a responsible breeder.... and honestly.. if they are responsible ... they don't need to put puppies on the internet.. they have reservations list for any litters they are planning.

Hello, Tanza..
The way If the breeder shouldnt put on net the a pup! Good breeders must be very wariliy about when and how much plan, do litters! We shouldnt do litter only why - somebody will buy them of course… its sad! Our sire is not yet made, but I have 4 (2pet, 2 breeder) fix people to waiting for my pup... this is the best, I think!!!

[tanza]

@africanbasenji:

Hello, Tanza..
The way If the breeder shouldnt put on net the a pup! Good breeders must be very wariliy about when and how much plan, do litters! We shouldnt do litter only why - somebody will buy them of course… its sad! Our sire is not yet made, but I have 4 (2pet, 2 breeder) fix people to waiting for my pup... this is the best, I think!!!

Exactly, breeders (responsible ones) will have reservations for puppies before they breed. When the pups are born they will already have potential new homes… responsible breeders do not breed and then has to advertise them in the internet for sale.

Do not mistake this as responsible breeders should not put ads on many of these sites, because they should. We need ads from responsible breeder to try and teach people what a responsible breeder is and how to fine one. A few of us on this Forum have ads from time to time on NextDayPets or PuppyFind, but it is for education when they contact you about buying a Basenji.

[africanbasenji]

@tanza:

Exactly, breeders (responsible ones) will have reservations for puppies before they breed. When the pups are born they will already have potential new homes… responsible breeders do not breed and then has to advertise them in the internet for sale.

Do not mistake this as responsible breeders should not put ads on many of these sites, because they should. We need ads from responsible breeder to try and teach people what a responsible breeder is and how to fine one. A few of us on this Forum have ads from time to time on NextDayPets or PuppyFind, but it is for education when they contact you about buying a Basenji.

Yes, I think the same Good to se that your are responsible about your Basenjis! Everybody should learn the responsibility…
hugs, B

[etzbseder]

Pat, I just looked at your site, and it only lists one litter this year. I thought that you were going to have two?

[tanza]

@etzbseder:

Pat, I just looked at your site, and it only lists one litter this year. I thought that you were going to have two?

I am only listing the one right now, as we are not for sure that we all agree on the sire for the other co-breeding. If we can't agree on the sire after all, we will not do a co-breeding. I had thought that we had agreed, but turns out I jumped the gun a little to quickly.

[etzbseder]

Ok, no problem. You know where I stand in my desires for a puppy. I love the fact that all the puppies and parents are taken into consideration an are planned for before breeding. It really decreases the chance of issues.

[tanza]

@etzbseder:

Ok, no problem. You know where I stand in my desires for a puppy. I love the fact that all the puppies and parents are taken into consideration an are planned for before breeding. It really decreases the chance of issues.

Yup… I know, I still hope that it might work out, but time will tell. We are looking at other possible studs to use.

[Alex]

We came up with the US/Canada restriction initially to protect our forum users from potential fraud which we have seen too many times happen when the seller is located overseas.

Also, since the breeder would be located far away in another country it would be quite difficult for him/her to provide support a responsible breeder should provide to the buyer located in the US/Canada.

Since the date of our initial for sale rules post we have gained a lot more international users on the forum who can buy and sell within their own region. We are open to suggestions how rules can be potentially revised to include international members.

[tanza]

There are not many that post Basenjis or pups for sale here, at least not by responsible breeders. We may announce a litter that we are planning but not that we have pups for sale. I don't think that should be any different the our member breeders overseas. Then if a Forum member is interested they can contact that person privately for more information and it is their responsibility to do the research about the breeder and things like health testing. I do not think this forum should be used to sell puppies. The few that have posted here are "in my opinion" less then responsible.

But nothing wrong with posting breeding plans, different the posting puppies for sale