Basenji Color Question
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wrote on 13 Dec 2006, 16:35 last edited by
Wow - Glad you know how it works. So there are formulas for color breeding. Thanks for sharing all this info - very interesting, especially for you breeders. I had no idea.
For me, my top priorities were health, temperament, conformation and really color of the sire wasn't that important to me though I was hoping for a black female, Rally was responsible for passing on that trait.
I like the idea of breeding for health & temperment. For me, all Basenji coat colors are beautiful. A healthy, playful Basenji is what I would find most important too.
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wrote on 13 Dec 2006, 20:00 last edited by
<_>
It would still have to be generations of black to black to even guess that they were pure for black, right? Same with brindle? Is the belief still that black and brindle are on/off…I mean the recessive to brindle, is no brindle? Does that make sense?_
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Not really, 25% of puppies in a black to black breeding should statistically be homozygous for the trait. You wouldn't really know until you bred them and only produced blacks that they were or weren't though.Actually, although I don't know if it has been published, it is my understanding that the genes for black, brindle, not black nor brindle have been found. There are 3 possible genes for the location either Black, Brindle, or Neither with Neither being the recessive trait._
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wrote on 13 Dec 2006, 20:04 last edited by
So, to make it interesting, you could have a four color litter of pups with these parents: Tri-factored red (looks RED, carries tri gene) x Tri factored black brindle (looks BLACK, actually has "invisible" stripes, and carries tri gene)
Dogs that are Black carrying brindle can only produce Blacks, Brindles, and Trindles. So in your example above, only a 3 colored litter is possible because black and brindle are at the same location.
If Rally had been tri factored, I could have had a 5 color litter with the combination that I had. Black, Brindle, Red, Tri, and Trindle.
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wrote on 15 Dec 2006, 16:53 last edited by
Many people don't realize there were originally creme colored basenjis, and fawn, and blue? Over the years, breeders have bred specifically for the three (now four) accepted colors, so the other colors were lost for the most part. I think the discussion of color is fascinating. With the African imports in the llate eighties, and now in the last few years, we are now really able to explore more about the natural coloration in Basenjis.
Wow, now this sounds really neat. I would love to see pictures of these other colored basenjis specially one in blue.
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wrote on 26 Jan 2008, 08:55 last edited by
Does somebody know something more about recessive black?
http://www.basenji.org/african/gont6812.htm -
wrote on 26 Jan 2008, 15:05 last edited by
We do not have what geneticists consider true "recessive black". We do have modifiers that minimize the amount of tan on tris to produce dogs that are nearly all black. Most of these dogs have some tan bleeding as they age.
http://www.kanibaru.com/2002pups.html
Here is a website with pics of one as a puppy and then at 1 year where you can see a little tan bleeding behind the ear, under the arms, and at her tuck up.
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wrote on 26 Jan 2008, 15:46 last edited by
Is any body else hearing Charlie Brown's teacher right now?
LOL.Man! How do you keep it all straight?
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wrote on 27 Jan 2008, 17:18 last edited by
Is any body else hearing Charlie Brown's teacher right now?
LOL.Man! How do you keep it all straight?
ROFL! I actually hear Charlie Brown's teacher when people start talking about alelles and such for genetics myself. I just have a learning issue where all that is concerned. As long as I understand the basics of color inheritance, that's all I care about. ;)
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wrote on 27 Jan 2008, 17:33 last edited by
For those who might want a refresher course on basic genetics here is a link to the powerpoint notes that I give my high school Biology students. To make it basenji related, I do use basenjis as an example.
http://www.phs.wjusd.org/voss/Genetics%202007.ppt#256,1,Genetics
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wrote on 27 Jan 2008, 17:40 last edited by
Ooo my head hurts!
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wrote on 27 Jan 2008, 18:23 last edited by
I just told my wife yesterday, "lvoss always has a very good explanation on color/genetics, she must have a biology degree or something." lol, looks like that was right on target:D Thanks for the powerpoint
For those who might want a refresher course on basic genetics here is a link to the powerpoint notes that I give my high school Biology students. To make it basenji related, I do use basenjis as an example.
http://www.phs.wjusd.org/voss/Genetics%202007.ppt#256,1,Genetics
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wrote on 14 May 2008, 00:39 last edited by
ok so i'm still confused i read it over and over….my bro just got a beautiful tri puppy through a private sale. The previous owner has the parents pedigree but not the pups, which sounded ok to me but it shows both parents being red/white. So can 2 red/whites produce a tri?
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wrote on 14 May 2008, 00:43 last edited by
Yes, tri is a recessive trait so can show up even when neither parent is tri.
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wrote on 14 May 2008, 02:17 last edited by
ok so i'm still confused i read it over and over….my bro just got a beautiful tri puppy through a private sale. The previous owner has the parents pedigree but not the pups, which sounded ok to me but it shows both parents being red/white. So can 2 red/whites produce a tri?
I bred Maggii (red and white, tri factored) to Bantu (red and white tri factored) we had a litter of 3 reds and 3 tris….
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wrote on 23 Sept 2010, 18:20 last edited by
Wow, now this sounds really neat. I would love to see pictures of these other colored basenjis specially one in blue.
Sarah Lee of Nocturnal Kennels has the blue basenjis. They are only CKC registered because AKC does not recognize the blues. but they are really neat to see. Sarah is a very nice lady also!
http://www.breeders.net/detail.php?id=213060
There is a picture here. I believe the dams name is Isis. and then in the picture of 4 basenjis, the 3rd from the left is a blue puppy. :) hope to help!
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wrote on 23 Sept 2010, 18:23 last edited by
Sarah Lee of Nocturnal Kennels has the blue basenjis. They are only CKC registered because AKC does not recognize the blues. but they are really neat to see. Sarah is a very nice lady also!
http://www.breeders.net/detail.php?id=213060
There is a picture here. I believe the dams name is Isis. and then in the picture of 4 basenjis, the 3rd from the left is a blue puppy. :) hope to help!
Technically not correct. The dogs are not registered with the AKC because somewhere along the line breeders of these dogs chose not to register them with AKC. AKC would certainly allow a dog blue basenji to be registered, if it was a purebred basenjis that came from AKC registered dogs. We have no disqualifications in the AKC standard.
If that Blue Basenji is purebred, then it would technically be ddkkyy..or a tri with the dilute gene expressed.
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wrote on 23 Sept 2010, 18:38 last edited by
Technically not correct. The dogs are not registered with the AKC because somewhere along the line breeders of these dogs chose not to register them with AKC. AKC would certainly allow a dog blue basenji to be registered, if it was a purebred basenjis that came from AKC registered dogs. We have no disqualifications in the AKC standard.
If that Blue Basenji is purebred, then it would technically be ddkkyy..or a tri with the dilute gene expressed.
Really?! Oh i thought it was because she couldnt do the blues. That is what she thought too. but that makes more sense. :) If the parents werent registered then neither could the puppies. Thanks for the clearification :) And the continued learning experience :)
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wrote on 24 Sept 2010, 00:05 last edited by
She has been told by several people that blues are registerable with AKC if they are from AKC registered parents.
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wrote on 25 Sept 2010, 21:44 last edited by
She has been told by several people that blues are registerable with AKC if they are from AKC registered parents.
Sarah got into a car accident and was affected quite badly by it. She has a hard time retaining new information and remembering the old things so she might have been told and may have forgotten. She gets things messed up sometimes because of the results of the accident.
Oh, i almost forgot. She got them from a lady who bred and raised the blues. The lady ended up passing away and the dogs were inherited to Sarah in the will. When she got the Blues, the son of the lady who owned them would not give her the papers as he didnt want to go through everything because he didnt care about the dogs. He wanted to burn everything and sell the house as quickly as he could so that he could sell it and get the money. He was very stuck up and didnt have a care in the world for the dogs or his dead mother. Its sad that people are like that :( …but anyways that is why they are not registered with AKC.
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wrote on 25 Sept 2010, 23:42 last edited by
Boy, I will put my flame retardent suit on here before I say this - in the picture of the four basenjis, well, they look so unhappy. ALL of them. I sympathize with the breeder in that she has some medical/mental restrictions, but the look of the breeding facility frightens me.
