Judging from what being said. I would say things are on hold until next year! But Good Luck All The Same x
Hopeful Basenji Owner!
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and keep in mind that Basenji can get over a chain link fence, paw over paw.
[removed email address]
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@nodles91 WOW? really... I have had many Basenjis over the years and and pottty training is a time in place... it doesn't happen overnight... just because they once "get it", doesn't mean they are house trained... and when there is rain... get used to YOU need to get as wet as they do.... and it is uncommon with this breed... at least in my 30yrs in the breed. Biting... yes all puppies, Basenjis are no different... and especially if from a less than responsible breeder.... bite inhibition comes from raising with the litter and other adults in the house... they teach them way more than humans. My Basenjis go out side to potty, however many times I am more wet then they are...., my Basenjis never beg at the table... however they know that after we are done they get treats.. and there is NOTHING wrong with "leftovers".... you eat them... they can eat them... but my Basenjis know that the dinner table is not acceptable to choose to try and get food... sitting in a room other than the food table.. they really don't know the difference unless you teach them that...
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Hi, everyone is talking about the allergy side, but how are your husbands nerves? This is a Basenji we are talking about....a rollercoaster ride in the form of a dog. The best and worst dog you will ever have.....the best way outweighs the worst part. Have fun!!!
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@nodles91, I would say your potty training issues are unusual. Mine learned quickly, my 3rd one learned in a couple of weeks! Rain, yes, a problem. As tanza says, you will have to get wet too! And it will vastly increase your off colour vocabulary while you wait in the rain for results, but my rule was we aren't going back in until you comply. In a desperate case I would "match" to induce defecation. Generally getting a pee was relatively easy and could be done in the backyard by refusing reentry to the house until I saw a result, although the neighbours must have gotten tired of me yelling "go pee" out the door!
Begging? I could sit on the couch eating my dinner with my Basenji beside me and there would be no attempts at stealing unless my attention was elsewhere (they know!) But don't leave food in an easily reachable location and expect it to be there when you come back.
Respect is very important with a Basenji. You must respect them, but absolutely you need to gain their respect. As with any dog, consistency is key. What you allow and do not allow cannot vary from day to day. More than most, they need to know where the line is that they cannot cross (which doesn't mean they won't test it from time to time). If my last boy was underfoot in the kitchen, all I had to say was "be someplace that is not here!" and he would leave. (yeah, I talked to my dogs like that. They understood me very well).
The biggest challenge I found with all of my Basenjis was keeping a straight face when they mischievously pushed the limits. Laughing gives the game away, so don't laugh at behaviour you want to discourage! Not easy.....
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Wow Basenji owners with their finger on the pulse Brilliant. My Basenji was a rescue from Spain. We got him at 10 mths and he was house trained from the start. I read everything i could on the breed ( and still do to remind me) and these are the main points that stick in my mind.
- Be two steps ahead of your Basenji at all times.
- Their attitude is 'What's in it for me'.
- When they run off, NEVER chase you'll just be joining in the game. They will come back when they are ready.
- NEVER, NEVER shout at them, you'l just wind them up.
- They are very loyal and want to be close whenever they can,
- Don't let them off the lead.
My George is all of these things and more. His hunting instinct is for food. He can sniff out a black sack, dropped food or something revolting but tasty at about 40 yards and when he does if he's off lead, he's gone. Now he knows the best spots where he usually finds food regardless of traffic, hedges, garden etc. If he doesn't find anything then I can get him back by shaking the box of carrots I always carry. He really keeps me on my toes. He's not too good on the lead unless he has his Halti harness, the he walks along side me nicely but if he's just with a lead on his collar he pulls very hard. He can slip his collar and harness if he chooses so I have to be aware in advance of anything he may want to chase after. When I want to let him run free I have to have a good look round and if he looks towards something he doesn't come off lead.
When he was young he would chase with other dogs and play with my other dog but now he's 7 yrs and my other dog has gone to doggy heaven. George no longer plays but sniffs out food all the time and eats anything, it's a nightmare. At home he ignores my cats and sleeps all day cuddled up to me on the sofa. He sleeps next to me on the bed at night and sometimes I wake up with George next to me and my 2 cats also snuggled up. I'm now disabled and have limited energy but with all this I wouldn't have it any other way. He's a thief, an escape artist, food fanatic, loving, cuddly, talkative boy and I love him.
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@tanza yes, really. Thanks, but i already go outside with my dogs every single time they go out, wet or dry.
He's kept near me at all times in the home so he can be closely monitored and corrected. Yet he still goes potty right in front of me in the house,and holds it outside.
I have a behaviorist, I've talked to tons of basenji breeders that have worked with the breed for decades. And I've gotten no where. The only method i have not tried is matching him. With him it would be a lot more than a one time fix and i don't think that's a healthy long term solution.
The begging is more than just that, he will bite my kids trying to steal their food from them. Mind you, He is not food aggressive when it comes to his food. He is only aggressive when it comes to trying to steal from us. He is told no, i stand up, i make him move away from the table and sit on his bed. Within seconds of me sitting back down he is back again. And repeat.
No dogs are allowed on the couch in this house (unless invited) to put healthy boundaries in place. Guess which dog has to be pulled down from the couch non stop every day. Lol
Again, behaviorist, constant training, i work from home and my day is pretty much focused on him, and every day is a battle, with extremely slow improvements over time. He is not my first dog, he is not my only dog, and he is the only dog that exhibits these behaviors.
Which, according to his breeder is only because he is a dominant male... Less than ideal breeding could also be a factor. -
@nodles91 - I would have to agree, less than ideal breeding is a total factor....
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@tanza I've always only rescued. I thought i asked all the right questions and got all the right answers. Plus when you rescue you generally think nurture trumps nature anyways. It's how you raise them, not how they're bred (i still think this is true for most). It was only later on that i realized he probably isn't the best at what he does. He's certainly not a puppy mill or anything terrible. But i just don't think he raises good house dogs (they're outside quite a lot) or works to breed specifically for temperament. Just this last breeding season one of his boys tore his leg wide open and he posted pictures of blood gushing down his leg like it was no big deal. I think he said something along the lines of, "this is what happens when you breed basenjis!"
Now I'm no breeder so that could be the norm... I really don't know. But my initial thought was, oh that was definitely my dogs dad. Lol
Either way, I'm stuck with the little demon now so we just do the best we can. Lol -
edited note: Below is said in fun...the word was invented for makeup industry..but lots more fun to discuss words than some topics. I'm not disputing your reasoning.
Lol splitting hairs, but I'll play.
Most people read it with the general medical usage. Even,gasp, Mayo clinic.
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/pet-allergy/expert-answers/hypoallergenic-dog-breeds/faq-20058425Either way, vets and research agrees that breeds with continual growing hair come closest to hypoallergenic. Even then, if we really want to spilt hairs, it's not that the dog has less allergic properties, it's just that they spread it less.
hy·po·al·ler·gen·ic (hīpō-alĕr-jenik)
Property of a substance or material that indicates it does not elicit a hypersensitivity reaction. -
@nodles91
You need a new behaviorist...one in spitting distance of the clue bucket.Potty training...mine not too well hinged rescue would hold pooping in the rain or even wet ground until she had an anal gland rupture. Only dog I've ever even heard of that match sticks didn't work. (By the way, if it works, after a few times they know the options and usually go.) I put her on fiber so she no longer could resist. Yeah she often went on the backporch...I didn't care.
I am sorry, but if you either leash the dog to you, or crate, unless outside, they can't be going all over the house. It may take a boring couple of months, but few dogs can't e housebroken. If you're not willing to do that, get an indoor potty system.
All that is trivial compared to you casually talking about your children being bruised and bloodied.
Back to your behaviorist and the clue bucket. You have a situation that is on the line, if not over it, for child abuse. At what point do you make protecting them the priority? When it rips their face, or you have company and end up being sued, or someone reports you for child endangerment?
Your dog is out of control. Your cavalier attitude about it attacking your children as if you have no control is horrifying. Crate the dog, get a basket muzzle, find a responsible trainer ..one who didn't even seem to have told you to at least crate the dog when anyone is eating!
It is well past time to get it controlled or euthanized. Bad breeding, bad training, it doesn't matter. A dog that bites is one that has to be stopped one way or another.
Debra
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We love our Basenjis and it took several years to find the two youngsters we have now after our first died. But they do shed and are very eager to sit and be close to their human companions. One has a courser coat with dander the other a finer coat without and they both have the same diet.
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@nodles91
OMG - I feel so sorry for you. My basenji is 13 years old - she have never peed or pooped in my house - even as a puppy. I was very vigilant about taking her outside often when she was young. She would then paw @ me when she needed to go outside. She would wake me up @ 1 and 2 am to take her out to do her business - I had my husband put in a doggie dog about 10 years ago and it has been a blessing. She still likes to do most her her business on her walks but has a poop/pee station she utilizes when she needs to.
Basenjis are very clean and like to be clean - hopefully you'll have success with his bathroom training. -
@debradownsouth that was so completely dramatic. Calm down.
I never said my dog viciously attacks my children. He nips when he wants to play, often too hard. And he snaps when he gets frustrated over wanting their food. I said there have been bruises and minor punctures over the last year and a half. I didn't say it's a daily occurrence now, most were caused by rough play. And my children certainly aren't gushing blood and being rushed to the hospital. I'm not neglecting my children, and I'm not going to kill their dog either!
No, it isn't an ideal situation but i am doing absolutely everything to correct it (not standing idly by as you seem to suggest, are you having a bad day?), and while progress has been slow, it's still progress. The biting has not yet been entirely resolved, but it's a significant improvement from where we were last year.
I'm not sure what lead you to attack my behaviorist when i said no more than the fact that i have one. I didn't imply what his techniques were or how he works with the dog. Apparently you are psychic and were able to determine that he's clueless based on no information other than the fact that he exists lol.
I have on multiple occasions gone back to basics and kept him crated or on lead at all times, but he doesn't mind going in the crate, and he doesn't mind going right at my feet on the carpet. Once i interrupt him and run him outside its like he never had to go and he holds it again. Eventually with consistency i am able to get him to the point that he has very few to no accidents inside and he then earns more freedom inside. And then it rains and I'll have to start all over again....
And being a member of every basenji group there is, when seeking advice i have had others chime in that they have similar problems. Thats why i said it is not uncommon, i certainly didnt say it was the "norm".
Sure, i can put him in the crate during meals. And sometimes i have to when he's especially determined, but that's not fixing the problem the problem is still there, festering. You don't modify behavior by caging it. Behavior modification is a long process that takes dedication. That's what a BEHAVIORIST does. -
I have read that basenjis are great in apartment situations because they choose to hold their pee longer than others. In my case that is very true. I don't live in an apartment and have had yards but both of mine would rather make me walk them instead of going in the yard. It was not until we bought a house with a half acre that they would even consider going in the yard and I had to make/train them to do so. I guess they don't like to dirty their living space
fine with me.Mine have only gone in the house in severe emergency and I felt my female I raised from a baby was very easy to train. I did not train our male (my boyfriend did) but he is just as good at never going in the house, even being alone for 7-8 hours. The breeder had already had our female box trained before I got her at 8 weeks so it was an easy transition. Start with the box always being near them when they play and sleep, You need to watch them and see the signs, you need to place them in the box sometimes.Then after they gain more control of their duties, move it to the door, when they go by the door and have not started to pee/poo yet, take them out. Then after they are used to that, remove the box and watch carefully for when they go by the door. Mine started to scratch the door, the male however used to stand at our feet or stare at us... He will now also go to the door. The one emergency was I away from home for most the day with a friend to walk her in the middle of the day and she got diarrhea. When I got home I could see she chewed at all the door handles, ripped down some window blinds, and tore all the jackets off the door hooks trying to get out. I felt so bad for her, she tried so hard
I have not heard of other breeds with this behavior.Rain and wet ground is an issue with basenjis, I will agree to that 100% - I had to force them onto the grass and tell them to go pee, go pee, go pee, go pee; in their more mature days, its not as hard. They will hold it in for hours and hours and stay in bed all day if you let them when its raining!
My two cents about biting, my boyfriend's male can get really rough and I don't like to excite him too much in fear of feeling the pain. My boyfriend and his two kids had always roughed house with him like that so I blame them for raising him that way... I always warn kids, don't mess with him and DONT RUN AWAY, he will get you. My female is very mellow and I have not had any issues like that with her, I trained her that way
I would play with her and let her use her mouth but I would TALK to her and let her know when it was too hard.And YES, never chase after them. I call their names so they look at me and run the opposite direction or pretend to bend down and be interested in something on the ground, works like a charm. You get them to play YOUR game.
Positive reinforcement and deterring bad behavior is the only way, Worked like a charm for me. Say, "no, that is my shoe, here play with your toy or chew your bone." Hand them the bone/toy.
My biggest warning for hopeful basenji owners is consider they are hunters and like to chase. typically, you cannot have them run free in any situation. They are not car/road smart and might run too far away chasing an animal. I used to have a nice, safe beach I would let my female run on 3-4 times a week and I trained her to come on command with the use of homemade chicken jerky, but typically, I think most basenjis will only come back to you when they are ready based on what I have read. I think I had spent so much time training my girl, she was sort of an exception . They are not like labs where you can have them free and they will safely follow you around.
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@tanza
Shedding. Easy for care of a Basenji, just run a hacksaw blade over its skin area that is shredding. Hold the blade vertical as you draw it from head to tail.[removed email address]
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@nodles91 said in Hopeful Basenji Owner!:
@debradownsouth that was so completely dramatic. Calm down.
I never said my dog viciously attacks my children. He nips when he wants to play, often too hard. And he snaps when he gets frustrated over wanting their food. ....
.....not standing idly by as you seem to suggest, are you having a bad day?), ...The biting has not yet been entirely resolved, but it's a significant improvement from where we were last year.
.....I'm not sure what lead you to attack my behaviorist when i said no more than the fact that i have one. I didn't imply what his techniques were or how he works with the dog. Apparently you are psychic and were able to determine that he's clueless based on no information other than the fact that he exists lol. ....
...... with consistency i am able to get him to the point that he has very few to no accidents inside and he then earns more freedom inside. And then it rains and I'll have to start all over again....
.....Sure, i can put him in the crate during meals. And sometimes i have to when he's especially determined, but that's not fixing the problem the problem is still there, festering. You don't modify behavior by caging it. ...
#########First. ...regarding your children..I don't need to comment further...your own posts demonstrate I wasn't bring dramatic.
>>>Biting! All puppies bite. Basenjis are worse. You can't yelp or say ow to teach bite inhibition because that exites them and they bite harder. The last year and a half has come with many bruises and minor punctures. He no longer bites me, but he still has a go at the kids from time to time because they are not as good at controlling their reaction....
Even though my kids have been bloodied and bruised by this dog...
The begging is more than just that, he will bite my kids trying to steal their food from them.....
2nd..your behaviorist
""I have a behaviorist i work with and i have been very focused on training from day one and it's still a struggle.....<<<<
Your failure to train even basic commands makes being a psychic unnecessary. The fact that you write that you get him trained but then it rains and you have to start all over tells me your behaviorist has failed words to grasp the need to keep up training for much longer, through rainy weather. Or you aren't being upfront. Sort of like in one post you write "So he refuses to potty outside and there has been pee and poop everywhere! ", but in the next you state you keep him right by you.
So maybe your behaviorist is great and you aren't following through..but most behaviorists would be really concerned about being connected with a dog like that who has drawn blood more than once. Whatever, it's obvious that there is very little progress when you have biting children, not housebroken, gets on furniture and has to be dragged off, won't stay when told...so a new person may help.
I have seen the damage done by even 30 pound dogs. So no, not drama.
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@debradownsouth You're a gem, Debra. I've also said my dog knows basic commands, and knows them well. I've stated that we practice them daily. He's excellent when we are working with treats in the house, he stays, he sits, he lays, he rolls over, he goes to his crate on command, he spins, etc. But if he is given a command while he'd rather be doing something else, he chooses to ignore.
Yes i said "pee and poop everywhere!" while describing my personal experience with my basenji over the last YEAR AND A HALF because potty training has been a struggle. It was meant to be a colorful (humorous) description, not a literal description of what my house looks like at this very moment lol. You cannot be that dense. You're just looking for a fight.
A behaviorist has no qualms with a PUPPY that has broken skin. It is literally their job to assist with behavior problems, you don't hire a behaviorist for a well mannered dog. You do know there is a difference between a trainer (the one that would probably slap a muzzle on a dog, toss them in a crate, and recommend euthanasia for anything beyond general obedience training like you are doing) and a certified behaviorist right?
Thanks, but I'll keep taking my advice from trained professionals, not crazy women on the internet that think they have all the answers based on a brief written description of experiences over an extended period of time. Which no professional, or even person with basic knowledge would ever do because that is not enough to go on. I didn't post here asking the all knowing Debra to enlighten me with her vast experience that tops all others! I shared a brief description of personal experiences, experiences that may not be the norm, But that others certainly have had with these dogs so they are important to keep in mind.
Crying child abuse, and recommending a dog you've never met be killed is DRAMATIC and uncalled for.
Keep it up... And i might sick my viscous killer dog on you! -
@gigi said in Hopeful Basenji Owner!:
@DebraDownSouth All I can say is WOW! Another cranky day? You seem to be a self-proclaimed expert on everything. I read back on old posts throughout this site – it looks like you have many of those cranky days...you might wanna get some meds from a conventional doctor for that.
There’s a thin line between being passionate about one’s belief’s and trying to intimidate or dominate (bully) others. You have a very disrespectful and antagonistic way of responding to people looking for help, which makes most people not pay much attention to what you have to say...which is mostly you're posting links anyway. Now, you'll tell your latest victim some lame excuse why you were rude and move on to your next prey. * Oh btw, this was said in fun!<<<<<<
Last first..you haven't learned much reading if you think I have ever pretended I was joking when I wrote a serious post. Hard to believe you read many of my posts and would even make such a comment. I am aware tone can be hard to read, so I noted my intent. When I am not joking , I'm pretty sure no one mistakes it for kidding.
Second, CrazySenji is a respected responsible Basenji person. I thought it abit fun to spar over silliness since she has rarely posted anything I seriously disagreed with that I can recall. I am pretty sure she's not going to feel like a victim over any comment on any board.
Third, your personally abusive post makes you just a wee bit of a hypocrite. It's okay..
I may be snarky, but I you may want to watch your own behaviors. Telling someone they needs meds is a low insult to those who do require medications. Sort of like using " retard" as an insult, it says more about the person saying it than the person being insulted.As for quotes/links...I don't ask people to accept things because I believe them. I give links to research and experts etc. I very often back up what I say rather than..as you accused me of, pretend to be an expert. l am sorry you have issues with my providing links. Isn't it fortunate that no one has to read them?
For the rest, hopefully the form will restore the ignore button so you can never have to read my posts again. Because you nailed two things.
First, having worked with rescue almost 40 years, I actually am very informed about some things...responsible breeding, training, the suffering of the poorly bred dogs sold to anyone who has the money, often bred with health/genetic disorders. I also can spot the people who talk a caring game but will throw it to the wind for expedience. I can also watch nice people try to gently walk on eggshells and know when they get shut down, nice isn't going to work.
And you are right, I don't respect irresponsible breeders, and I don't respect people who know better and still take the fast route, or people who allow a dog to bite children. I don t respect irresponsible owners who don't take care of their dogs. That isn't likely to change. I don't, as you did, get into insults and low personal comments. But I see no reason to candy coat some thing.
So no I'm not having a cranky day. It's been quite productive day. More so, I suppose, if I had skipped the forum.
Debra
Debra
