This video ticks me off

[Porthos]

Well, I didn't mean to cause any arguments… Everyone has had some very good points. I agree with all of you, but something about it still bothers me.

[Porthos]

I've got it… I just watched it again and now I know what is bothering me with this video. If you notice, the Basenji got upset when this guy approaches Niles and not only when he pets him. Niles does not want him to touch him at all and that leads me to think that maybe he has been abusive to Niles... Just my opinion, I guess i will leave it at that...

[Alex]

Prothos,

I agree with you, I think the guy might have encouraged that type of behaviour and teased him in the past. The dog definitely does not want to be petted by him that way.

It's all speculation at this point, who knows what the real story behind this video and the dogs behaviour.

[JazzysMom]

I wonder if it's not the CAMERA that gets the dog going.

My brother used to have a dog that was wonderful, UNTIL someone pulled a camera out. Then he would go ballistic, growling, etc. He HATED cameras. We never did figure out why.
And there was an episode of the {Shhh–-} Dog Whisperer once where a dog got really nutso when the family pulled out their video camera. Made filming the episode interesting, but in the end the dog learned the camera was harmless.

AND, camera aside, this is what Keoki used to do when anyone, then finally it got down to just dh, approached when he was resting. We just kept on - talking to him, petting him, telling him "no" when the growling got too intense, etc. and now he seldom even growls at dh.

[Vanessa]

@Porthos:

I've got it… I just watched it again and now I know what is bothering me with this video. If you notice, the Basenji got upset when this guy approaches Niles and not only when he pets him. Niles does not want him to touch him at all and that leads me to think that maybe he has been abusive to Niles... Just my opinion, I guess i will leave it at that...

I agree with your comment. After watching the video it leads me to believe that the basenji just doesn't like him. To react so violently makes me think that his buttons are pushed often. What a jerk! I see it as a form of animal abuse.

[wizard]

I'm like Diego'sMom - at first I thought it was kind of funny but then clearly that guy was doing something that was agitating the basenji big time. I would never continue to do something if it set off my dog (any dog) in that manner.
And to be proud of it - what a creep!

[Quercus]

@JazzysMom:

I wonder if it's not the CAMERA that gets the dog going.

My brother used to have a dog that was wonderful, UNTIL someone pulled a camera out. Then he would go ballistic, growling, etc. He HATED cameras. We never did figure out why.
And there was an episode of the {Shhh–-} Dog Whisperer once where a dog got really nutso when the family pulled out their video camera. Made filming the episode interesting, but in the end the dog learned the camera was harmless.

AND, camera aside, this is what Keoki used to do when anyone, then finally it got down to just dh, approached when he was resting. We just kept on - talking to him, petting him, telling him "no" when the growling got too intense, etc. and now he seldom even growls at dh.

good point about the camera. A lot of dogs react strangely to that…especially video cameras because they obscure so much of your face.

But, still...not a good thing to allow your dog to practice, IMO....

[UnluckyDrabBear]

I know I'm in the minority, but my boyfriend and I think this video is hilarious. The reason we do is beacuse it was a relief to see another B that makes those same noises. We got Sophie three years ago from a shelter and she had clearly been abused. She looked and sounded like Niles any time she was touched while she was curled up and relaxing. She even bit my boyfriend once when he tried to move her from the couch. It has taken years of "pushing her buttons" (and by this I mean talking to her while touching/ nudging her while she is curled up) but we now rarely get the attitude, and she is much safer for kids to be around. I can understand it looks disturbing to those who have never had to deal with it, but sometimes IMO pushing them a little past their comfort zone is really the best thing for them.

[JazzysMom]

@Quercus:

good point about the camera. A lot of dogs react strangely to that…especially video cameras because they obscure so much of your face.

But, still...not a good thing to allow your dog to practice, IMO....

Right, I think he took totally the wrong approach. I just don't think it was necessarily a sign that any abuse had ever taken place.

[Quercus]

@JazzysMom:

Right, I think he took totally the wrong approach. I just don't think it was necessarily a sign that any abuse had ever taken place.

Oh, I agree. I don't think this dog was abused. And I don't necessarily think that he doesn't like his 'dad'. But he doesn't like the routine that is going on, for sure.

When I likened it to abuse with a child, it was in the context that we have a much lower tolerance for emotional 'abuse' with children than we do with dogs (or other pets)..as we should In no way would I really consider what this guy is doing as abuse…sorry if I gave that impression. But foolish....and dangerous for the dog if/when he decides it is okay to snap at humans...absolutely!

[Janneke]

@BDawg:

The guy is obviously trying to imitate Steve Irwin.

That's why I find him irritating.. :rolleyes:

[UnluckyDrabBear]

I know I'm in the minority, but my boyfriend and I think this video is hilarious. The reason we do is beacuse it was a relief to see another B that makes those same noises. We got Sophie three years ago from a shelter and she had clearly been abused. She looked and sounded like Niles any time she was touched while she was curled up and relaxing. She even bit my boyfriend once when he tried to move her from the couch. It has taken years of "pushing her buttons" (and by this I mean talking to her while touching/ nudging her while she is curled up) but we now rarely get the attitude, and she is much safer for kids to be around. I can understand it looks disturbing to those who have never had to deal with it, but sometimes IMO pushing them a little past their comfort zone is really the best thing for them.

[lvoss]

I think that most of us on here have heard our Bs make noises like what Niles is doing. Mine usually do it when one of the others is in their space usually standing on them or very nearly standing on them. It is really clear that they are telling the other dog to "get h#$% off".

What find disturbing about this video is that the person isn't doing something that should be illiciting this response and they are pushing the dog to the point where it is escalating to biting. I don't know why the dog has developed this response but it is not appropriate and how it is being handled is not appropriate.

I agree with Andrea and don't find anything funny in the video. I know too many dogs get euthanized for similar or even less extreme behavior.

[DiegosMom]

So I emailed the guy and asked why he annoys his dog so bad and if Niles is always aggressive like that, and this was his response.. To me he seems like a nice guy whos just trying to have fun, not trying to offend people..

"Hi and thanks for the email, and for the concerns! Always nice to hear that people are worried for Niles. Here is the deal with Nialator:

He is fine, it is not bad, and it is a game more than anything, both for Niles and for me. It started out when I was petting him and he sort of growled a bit and I stopped. He forced his head into my hand causing me to pet him more. I did and soon he growled again and I got scared and stopped, moved away and let him cool off. He came over to me and waited for more. I touched him ever so lightly, and went down his back very, very very slowly. When I get to the middle of the ribcage or so, he growls. I go hard and fast, maybe nothing, maybe he growls. I move to another part of the bed/couch/floor and he follows waiting for more. Now I can give him the eye and he will growl most of the time, and if I don't come to him fast enough he will come to me. I sometimes will say N I L E S very softly and every so slowly and he will growl. I am open to peoples medical or psychological/behavior opinions, but not to subjective views on this. I also Sing/Yell: W H OOOOOOOOOO (pause) W A AAAAAAAAAAANTS (pause) toGOOOOOOOOO FOOOOOOOR a WALK!!! and he sings/yodels as I get to waaaaants and g o o ooooo. Fun.

Not sure if this helps settle anything. Niles has always been vocal, it is not a demonstration of poor behavior at all. He also does not bite hard, it is all play, I just play it up for video and friends and show him off as ferocious. The only time he bites hard is if you run. He goes for the calf. Ouch."

[Robin_n_Jack]

hahaha- that's funny that he yodels and the dog yodels back.

I watched the video again, and I think the reason I am so disturbed is because my B has never made a sound like that…..and it is a freaking scary sound....I feel kinda bad actually, because I don't feel that it was right of me to presume that the guy had done something to set the dog off in my earlier post.....some dogs are just different that others. My Jack hardly ever makes any noise at all, so when I saw a dog that looks just like him, making that scary growly snarly noise, it was unsettling.

[Quercus]

@UnluckyDrabBear:

I know I'm in the minority, but my boyfriend and I think this video is hilarious. The reason we do is beacuse it was a relief to see another B that makes those same noises. We got Sophie three years ago from a shelter and she had clearly been abused. She looked and sounded like Niles any time she was touched while she was curled up and relaxing. She even bit my boyfriend once when he tried to move her from the couch. It has taken years of "pushing her buttons" (and by this I mean talking to her while touching/ nudging her while she is curled up) but we now rarely get the attitude, and she is much safer for kids to be around. I can understand it looks disturbing to those who have never had to deal with it, but sometimes IMO pushing them a little past their comfort zone is really the best thing for them.

Actually it looks the most disturbing to those of us that have had to deal with it the most…via rescue dogs, shelter dogs, and dogs in behavioral rehab.

Some of my own dogs have done this in certain situations, but the most effective training solution does not involve encouraging the dog to practice the behavior. And it certainly doesn't involve turning the behavior into a 'parlor trick' to entertain others....

[UnluckyDrabBear]

@Quercus:

the most effective training solution does not involve encouraging the dog to practice the behavior.

We tried using methods that were non-evasive but they were not effective at all. Keep in mind since all dogs are different, typical training methods sometimes don't work and new ideas need to be used. If it doesn't work then it is not effective.

[Alex]

This thread has been moderated as it is turning into an argument due to the nature of this video and everyones strong opinions about it. We are leaving it unlocked for now and encourage a healthy discussion.

Please respect our forum rules and each other, that is all we ask from eveyone in return for providing this venue. If you feel attacked the best thing is to report it to the moderator and just walk away instead of encouraging or trying to win arguments.

If you want to educate others about any topic, the best way is to compile some usefull material in a form of a forum sticky that summarizes the topic in an educational tone. Here is a sticky example which lvoss kindly put together: http://www.basenjiforums.com/showthread.php?t=3657

Our forum rules: http://www.basenjiforums.com/showthread.php?t=374

If you have any questions or concerns please email us privately admin@basenjiforums.com.

[LSanders]

I think the problem is the context of the video. If this was someone who had a basenji that had issues and they were trying to work on those issues, and videotaped it to share their problems so other basenji owners could learn from it/give advice, that would be one thing. This guy, whether he himself gave the dog reason to behave this way towards him or not, is obviously antagonizing the dog (repeatedly) to make fun of him, and to parody Steve Irwin, who probably didn't think he was antagonizing animals either.

I have heard a noise similar to this come out of my dog. He has a preference towards women; we don't know why- we haven't abused him or given him any reason to not like men, nor did our close friends who we got him from. But they had situations with him where under certain circumstances, Tana would be very aggressive towards the husband and he would back off. Tana has growled at my boyfriend (we live together, have since we got Tana two and a half years ago, so he's not new in my life or anything) several times like that before, and rarely at me. Tana is very protective of his kennel- that's HIS space and he doesn't like it if you invade it. He reacts much worse to my boyfriend getting him out of there than me. We have learned to just make a conscious effort to either avoid being in a situation where we have to pull him out of his kennel or do so in a positive manner.

I suspect that his issues stem from his breeder and life as a puppy. From our friend's account, she didn't seem to be a good breeder and Tana came to them as a puppy with a broken tail- another "sore spot" for him (literally!)- he REALLY doesn't like his tail touched and that's another time he's made that noise before, when we or someone else (i.e., vet's office, if I forget to warn them) has inadvertently touched his tail too roughly.

All of this being said, the Pug bowling video - now that's canine comedy.

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[tanza]

@LSanders:

I think the problem is the context of the video. If this was someone who had a basenji that had issues and they were trying to work on those issues, and videotaped it to share their problems so other basenji owners could learn from it/give advice, that would be one thing. This guy, whether he himself gave the dog reason to behave this way towards him or not, is obviously antagonizing the dog (repeatedly) to make fun of him, and to parody Steve Irwin, who probably didn't think he was antagonizing animals either.

I have heard a noise similar to this come out of my dog. He has a preference towards women; we don't know why- we haven't abused him or given him any reason to not like men, nor did our close friends who we got him from. But they had situations with him where under certain circumstances, Tana would be very aggressive towards the husband and he would back off. Tana has growled at my boyfriend (we live together, have since we got Tana two and a half years ago, so he's not new in my life or anything) several times like that before, and rarely at me. Tana is very protective of his kennel- that's HIS space and he doesn't like it if you invade it. He reacts much worse to my boyfriend getting him out of there than me. We have learned to just make a conscious effort to either avoid being in a situation where we have to pull him out of his kennel or do so in a positive manner.

I suspect that his issues stem from his breeder and life as a puppy. From our friend's account, she didn't seem to be a good breeder and Tana came to them as a puppy with a broken tail- another "sore spot" for him (literally!)- he REALLY doesn't like his tail touched and that's another time he's made that noise before, when we or someone else (i.e., vet's office, if I forget to warn them) has inadvertently touched his tail too roughly.

All of this being said, the Pug Bowling video- now that's canine comedy.

I don't agree… I find nothing helpful about that Video...... for any dog owner...

As far as your boy... sounds exactly as you describe... not a very good breeder and you are doing what is necessary to make all situations work for you and your home/family...