AKC National Championship today

[Zande]

I am not sure that I agree that humans are taking the Basenji in the right direction @JENGOSMonkey.

Heads for example. Basenjis are becoming longer in the foreface with pointed noses, no cushion and very little side wrinkle. Judging around the place - Russia, Australia, Scandinavia, Estonia, Germany, Czech Republic to name some, I have often surprised myself by putting up brindles although not caring for the colour.

When I did the German specialty, my BIS was a brindle from Norway and BOS a brindle from the Czech Republic. They had proper, if you like, old fashioned, Basenji heads (and apart from that, also true Basenji gait !) and I finally figured it out. . . .

Humans had had fewer generations to muck about with the natives brought back from Africa and so they retained much of what now we are losing. Sadly from brindles too.

btw @JENGOSMonkey , if you message me your email address I will send you some pieces you might be interested in.

I am getting my Covid jab tomorrow and the second eye (at my own expense but I have no choice. Insurance won't pay at a different hospital) on Friday. So don't expect anything too soon !

[eeeefarm]

@zande said in AKC National Championship today:

They had proper, if you like, old fashioned, Basenji heads (and apart from that, also true Basenji gait !) and I finally figured it out. . . .

Humans had had fewer generations to muck about with the natives brought back from Africa and so they retained much of what now we are losing.

Unfortunately once you start breeding to remove certain traits and accentuate others, you often end up losing something desirable or introducing unforeseen problems. Anyone who has dabbled in computer programming knows that a little seemingly innocuous tweak can cause unexpected results, and it is the same when you mess with genetics. The Russian Fox experiments are an extreme example. Breeding for better temperaments caused physical changes in the foxes.

There are valid reasons why sheepdog people did not want Border Collies to be recognized for show by the AKC and CKC. These dogs were always bred for performance, not pretty. You can lose a lot by emphasizing what the judges will put up in the show ring.

[DonC]

@zande said in AKC National Championship today:

I am getting my Covid jab tomorrow and the second eye (at my own expense but I have no choice. Insurance won't pay at a different hospital) on Friday. So don't expect anything too soon !

Sincerely hope both worked out for you.

@eeeefarm said in AKC National Championship today:

Unfortunately once you start breeding to remove certain traits and accentuate others, you often end up losing something desirable or introducing unforeseen problems.
...
You can lose a lot by emphasizing what the judges will put up in the show ring.

Amen. Amazing that such an obvious point is almost universally missed.

[tanza]

@jengosmonkey - The Tri in the video that you posted is the sire of our 2019 litter. GCHS AM Ch Astarte's Sir Tristan With Pips At Kazor x AM Ch Klassic's Joy Ride To Tanza-Jamaa. Since both Tristan and Joy are Tri's the pups were all Tri. This was the 2nd all Tri litter that I have had! Love those Tri Basenjis.... You can find pictures on my website, link below

[JENGOSMonkey]

@tanza I did not know that. Tristan is such a hansom dog. Joy is beautiful. Great pictures on your site. Logan is Tri recessive. He was bred last November, but there were no Tris. Sparkle is Tri recessive also. Perhaps she might produce a Tri next year. The good news is that I don’t have make any of the complicated choices. I just get them where they need to be on time. Sometimes it’s good not being the boss.

[tanza]

@jengosmonkey - All Tris are recessive. In order to get a Tri the recessive gene needs to be in both the sire & dam. Example Tri color to Tri Color will produce all Tri, Red that carries the Tri Gene to a Tri, either Red or Tri, Two Reds that carry the Tri gene either Red or Tri. My first Basenji bitch (back in 1994) was a red with tri recessive gene bred to a red with tri recessive gene, outcome of that litter was 3 red and 3 tri.

[JENGOSMonkey]

@tanza That works! I was hoping that the bitch Logan bred with might have been Tri recessive. I was rooting for a couple of tris. She had five. All red. I suppose it’s still possible to have all reds even if both parents are tri recessive?

[tanza]

@jengosmonkey said in AKC National Championship today:

@tanza That works! I was hoping that the bitch Logan bred with might have been Tri recessive. I was rooting for a couple of tris. She had five. All red. I suppose it’s still possible to have all reds even if both parents are tri recessive?

Correct, what is Logan's registered name? If there are Tri's in the pedigree, he might carry the Tri gene. If one of his parents are Tri he would carry the Tri gene. And yes it is totally possible to have all reds even if they both carry the Tri gene. What is the bitches registered name?

[JENGOSMonkey]

@tanza Logan is Astarte’s Logan’s World. His momma Zayna, who is a Tri, so I know he carries the gene. I don’t know the bitches registered name. I try and stay out of it. Our female is Astarte’s Sparkle Perfect. Both our Basenjis show up on Zande’s site. It’s back a ways, but Sparkle has a Black & White and a Brindle in there as well as tris.

[tanza]

@jengosmonkey - As said you can only be sure of a Tri litter if you have Tri to Tri... otherwise it is just what happens with the genes... LOL

[Zande]

And although a black streak through the tail indicates the dog (or bitch) carries tri, its absence does not mean there is no tri gene.

I have had tris from a bitch with not a sign of black fur in her tail, and actually no tris anywhere near close up in her pedigree.

Whispering in their ears during pregnancy is no help either. Trouble was a lovely tri and we were so hoping for her to pass her color on in at least one son. So I kept nagging her - But no. Five red and white girls eventually emerged !