@julia87 How much do you know about Basenjis? Have you met any? It's highly recommended to learn as much as possible about them before making a decision to acquire one. This would be a good place to start.
My neighbors sweet Gi Gi is desperate…
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I gave her some test strips myself yesterday….I have not seen her today yet. Where is Gonto's practice?
Is this treatable to normal urination? or, is it going to be an eventual death sentence.
Thanks again so much.
MIt is treatable, but can not be cured. It is a genetic disorder. Without treatment, it is a death sentence for sure. The earlier it is caught and treated the better chance to stabilize. Dr Gonto is not a Vet, see the link attached
http://basenjicompanions.org/health/fanconi/gonto.htmlHe has Basenjis and he is the one that developed the treatment for Fanconi. Blood gases are a must and blood panels too. Those can get expensive. The pills for treatment are not that expensive but they get many per day. Please read about Fanconi and pass that information on to the owner.
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The first step would obviously be to get the definitive diagnosis. At ten, she is a bit late for developing Fanconi (if she hasn't had symptoms previously that have worsened I would wonder if it is something else). The 10% figure probably came from the percentage of incidence in the breed. I have seen this figure before. But until you actually know what you have, it is hard to predict the cost or likely outcome.
Edited to add: Fanconi and kidney failure have similar symptoms, but the treatment for each is quite different. For sure you need a vet to determine what you have and how to proceed. Doing the strip tests gives you somewhere to begin the diagnosis.
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The first step would obviously be to get the definitive diagnosis. At ten, she is a bit late for developing Fanconi (if she hasn't had symptoms previously that have worsened I would wonder if it is something else). The 10% figure probably came from the percentage of incidence in the breed. I have seen this figure before. But until you actually know what you have, it is hard to predict the cost or likely outcome.
Edited to add: Fanconi and kidney failure have similar symptoms, but the treatment for each is quite different. For sure you need a vet to determine what you have and how to proceed. Doing the strip tests gives you somewhere to begin the diagnosis.
That is not true (the age of developing Fanconi), I know Basenjis that developed Fanconi that late. Granted could be that she was showing a small amount of symptoms prior.. and not noticed or treated. And while the average is 5yrs, most of the information states 3 to 8yrs. I have known Basenjis that were 2 that developed Fanconi and as late as 11yrs. And the number stated by the Basenji Club of America is 7% as of the discovery of the DNA Test (which I assume they are talking about the linkage test, but don't know that for a fact)
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We had one Basenji on the Fanconi list who developed it at age 16! So age is not a determiner. The only definitive diagnosis is spilling sugar in the urine and normal to low blood glucose - then the venous blood gases will help the vet determine the dosage of bicarbonate.
PLEASE, PLEASE urge your friend to get a vet with the knowledge and willingness to learn about and deal with this disease. Otherwise, she will watch her beloved Gigi get worse and worse and Gigi WILL die in a relatively short time. Until Dr. Gonto's protocol, this is simply what happened.
I speak from sad experience; we have lived with 6 Basenjis with Fanconi.
Terry
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We had one Basenji on the Fanconi list who developed it at age 16! So age is not a determiner. The only definitive diagnosis is spilling sugar in the urine and normal to low blood glucose - then the venous blood gases will help the vet determine the dosage of bicarbonate.
PLEASE, PLEASE urge your friend to get a vet with the knowledge and willingness to learn about and deal with this disease. Otherwise, she will watch her beloved Gigi get worse and worse and Gigi WILL die in a relatively short time. Until Dr. Gonto's protocol, this is simply what happened.
I speak from sad experience; we have lived with 6 Basenjis with Fanconi.
Terry
Amen Terry! Hugs
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I suggested 10 was old to be developing Fanconi because most are going to do so in the age range mentioned. (3 - 8 years). Obviously there may be exceptions, but if you are looking at probability rather than possibility you might want to consider other reasons for the symptoms. 16 is very interesting. It answers a question I have had about Fanconi, namely the penetrance of the gene. Many dogs will die of something else before age 16, so perhaps it is quite possible to have a Fanconi affected dog that will never display the phenotype. I think that has implications for breeders. I also wonder about what environmental conditions cause the expression of the gene. In any case, a diagnosis must be done on this dog so that the owner knows what treatment is appropriate.
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Fanconi would really be the best guess I can come up with based on the information given… Unfortunately, I suspect if money is an issue and she won't pay for the test strips then I doubt she will pay for the blood gases and medication needed via Dr.Gonto's protocol to make her better. It's sad because at 10 she could still see many more years...
I gave her a full bottle of test strips I had and no longer needed. I know they are a bit pricey, but I don't think she will hesitate with any treatment as long as she knows it's the RIGHT treatment.
Thank you…
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Pat, I am so incredibly grateful to you and the other posters. I can't wait to see Marcie and get her on this thread. I am SO enchanted with Gi Gi, she's such a little girl….sigh....
I'm going into hospital myself on Monday for a 2 day spinal fusion procedure, working through my abdoman on Monday, then filleting my whole back on Tuesday. Rods, bolts, wires etc...I have been scared out of my mind until I heard about Gi Gi's condition yesterday, now, I can't think of anything else BUT her...
I'm grateful for the distraction I guess, but jeez!, not THIS way....
Anyway, thank you so much again...I'll keep checkin in..
Michelle -
We had one Basenji on the Fanconi list who developed it at age 16! So age is not a determiner. The only definitive diagnosis is spilling sugar in the urine and normal to low blood glucose - then the venous blood gases will help the vet determine the dosage of bicarbonate.
PLEASE, PLEASE urge your friend to get a vet with the knowledge and willingness to learn about and deal with this disease. Otherwise, she will watch her beloved Gigi get worse and worse and Gigi WILL die in a relatively short time. Until Dr. Gonto's protocol, this is simply what happened.
I speak from sad experience; we have lived with 6 Basenjis with Fanconi.
Terry
Oh Terry, I am so sorry to hear of your pets, what a nasty disease. I am trying to contact her and will tell her. Thank you….Michelle
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I suggested 10 was old to be developing Fanconi because most are going to do so in the age range mentioned. (3 - 8 years). Obviously there may be exceptions, but if you are looking at probability rather than possibility you might want to consider other reasons for the symptoms. 16 is very interesting. It answers a question I have had about Fanconi, namely the penetrance of the gene. Many dogs will die of something else before age 16, so perhaps it is quite possible to have a Fanconi affected dog that will never display the phenotype. I think that has implications for breeders. I also wonder about what environmental conditions cause the expression of the gene. In any case, a diagnosis must be done on this dog so that the owner knows what treatment is appropriate.
The best news now is that with the direct test… we can rid our breed of Fanconi by being responsible breeders and "buyers" and not buying from a breeder that is not DNA testing with the direct test. Yes, there are ones out there that can and will develope Fanconi.. but as each year passes, the number grows smaller.
This poster didn't say how long this has been going on or what the strip testing has shows.. that is the tell tale sign... if spilling sugar in the urine it IS Fanconi and easy enough to rule out Fanconi with the strip test..... I wish that this for this girl is not the case -
The symptoms are also indicative of diabetes, lots of drinking, and the urinating that follows. The glucose strips will also test positive, then a blood chemistry will show whether there is sugar in the blood as well (diabetes) or not (Fanconi).
Were the strips you gave her for glucose, not ketones? Those glucose strips are hard to find these days as most diabetics check their blood instead of urine, but they still check for ketones.
I hope your friend is able to get a diagnosis and treatment for Gigi, and I hope your surgery goes well, that is big surgery!
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This poster didn't say how long this has been going on or what the strip testing has shows.. that is the tell tale sign… if spilling sugar in the urine it IS Fanconi and easy enough to rule out Fanconi with the strip test..... I wish that this for this girl is not the case
Not quite correct. Could also be diabetes. Because elevated urine glucose is also found in diabetes, Basenjis with Fanconi are often misdiagnosed with diabetes. Diabetes will show high blood glucose along with urine glucose. The combination of urine glucose and normal or low blood glucose strongly suggests Fanconi syndrome. Venous blood gas studies can verify an electrolyte imbalance consistent with Fanconi syndrome.
My other question…...subject of another thread perhaps......is whether we can definitely say we should not breed from Fanconi affected. Are there other, desirable, traits associated with and perhaps genetically intertwined with Fanconi that are worth preserving? Is there something environmental at play that determines the expression of the gene, and if we can identify that environmental factor would it be possible to suppress Fanconi by avoiding it? These questions are seldom black & white, and the science is still quite new. We could be guilty of "throwing the baby out with the bathwater" if we are not careful. Inherited genes often give some sort of advantage that may not be immediately apparent…....which may be why they continue to be passed on. (e.g. humans with heterozygous sickle cell anemia genes have resistance to malaria).
MacPack, you beat me to the diabetes. I was still typing.
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Did I miss something? What were the results of the test strip??
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I don't think the dog has been tested yet, or at least nobody has posted the results.
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eeeefarm - Of course you are correct about diabetes, I did forget to add that if spilling sugar, blood work is need to determine if sugar is high in the blood also.
As far as you statement about breeding, as not to hijack this thread, see http://www.basenjiforums.com/showthread.php?13042-Breeding-and-Fanconi-(Moved-from-GiGi-Thread)&p=155352#post155352 -
Poor little Gi Gi. Gi Gi's neighbor, you're right to be concerned. While there are many things it could be– Fanconi, diabetes, Cushings, age-related renal failure-- the fact that she is a Basenji displaying these symptoms means you should strip test for Fanconi. Bayer Diastix cost about $13 and can be found on Amazon or drugstore.com. If Gi Gi is spilling glucose in her urine, then your neighbor will need to get blood gases ASAP to see if there is glucose in the blood as well. This will direct your vet toward Fanconi or diabetes. Cushings usually has other obvious symptoms that you don't mention.
I don't mean to alarm you, but every day counts. By the time a Fanconi dog is symptomatic, she has had the disease for a good while, with the symptoms steadily progressing. Peeing the bed is pretty far down the road. But Fanconi, while terrible, isn't a death sentence. I have a Fanconi dog, and he's been doing well for more than eight years. We caught it early through strip testing and have been managing it with Dr. Gonto's protocol. Some kidney damage is irreversible, so it's crucial to stop further damage by treating the dog. Hopefully, your neighbor has already strip tested Gi Gi and will have blood gases and a full blood panel done right away. That will tell her whether or not Gi Gi has Fanconi and, if so, how compromised her kidneys are. I wish the best for Gi Gi and those who love her!
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You need to ask the vet if there was glucose in the urine if there was a urine test done. If the vet has not done a urine test one needs to be done ASAP. If there is glucose in the urine, then a fasting blood test needs to be done to test for a high glucose blood test result. If the blood test for glucose is normal then it is Fanconi and if the blood test for glucose is high then it is Diabetes. If Fanconi, go to the link that tanza provided and that will give you what will need to be done next which is a venous blood gas test. I would suggest changing vets to someone who is familiar with Fanconi. You can join the Fanconidogs group on Yahoo Groups.
Fanconi is not a death sentence! My girl has been living with Fanconi for about 6-7 years and is now 13 years old and is doing great on the protocol.
Jennifer
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Right, not a death sentence as many can confirm… but until it is confirmed.... you will never know.. most important thing is to get them tested if you find they are spilling sugar in the urine..........
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The best news now is that with the direct test… we can rid our breed of Fanconi by being responsible breeders and "buyers" and not buying from a breeder that is not DNA testing with the direct test. Yes, there are ones out there that can and will develope Fanconi.. but as each year passes, the number grows smaller.
This poster didn't say how long this has been going on or what the strip testing has shows.. that is the tell tale sign... if spilling sugar in the urine it IS Fanconi and easy enough to rule out Fanconi with the strip test..... I wish that this for this girl is not the caseHi Pat, I saw Marcie tonight and gave her ALL the great help you have provided. I also gave her the www. and I'm sure she will be on soon. At least she has solid direction now. BLESS YOU ALL!!!
Michelle Gi Gi's buddy -
Hello, I am gigi mom. I did the Diastix test twice and it came back negative. The vet ran a full body function blood the only thing postive is hypo thyroid which I am reading basenji need a different test, is that correct? G is still peeing in the bed and during the day. drinking a lot of water and my vet seems to be pretty slow at responding. This is a new mobile vet I am using and I made a call to him yesterday telling him I would like more testing done. I am hoping to get a return call by tomorrow. Any suggestions. I just want girl to feel better soon. I want to be able to get her the help she needs. Is there a possiblity that this is just old age. Could anyone recommend any other testing?
