Yup, nothing fun happens until everybody's peed. Today she saw the old man go out on HER walk hour and was DISPLEASED. I agreed with her that it sure would be fun to go for a romp!
I'm glad we're not the only dweebs who sing to our dogs. We've taken to improvising a life soundtrack to the tune of "Springtime for Hitler" that usually starts "____-time for Basenjis, ______". The past couple days it's been "Pottytime for basenjis, come on, go pee!" 😃
Can anyone explain to me how to teach Growl?
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While I understand everyone's concern about Dante's age, I do not understand why the owner appears to be taking the heat for something that is the breeders responsibility; no matter how subtley it is said - it is being said to the wrong person. Let's just be thankful that the owner is a) someone who is interested in doing the right thing and asking questions and b) a vet student who should be able to offer lots of appropriate care to Dante as he grows.
I do not agree that 6 weeks is too young to start training. What do we think pups are doing with mom and sibs if not teaching and learning themselves? While 6 weeks is too young to have ANY expectations they unequivocally know a behavior, it is never to early to start working with puppies. Each of my litters are introduced to all sorts of behaviors and cues the minute their eyes and ears are open. Mine are all quite proficient actually by 7 weeks at sitting AND waiting as a group for their supper as has been shown in the pictures I have used in articles and adverts.
While I think Dante's owner is on the right track with regard to teaching Dante tricks and manners, et al, I do also hope that s/he is putting as much effort into Dante's socializing. This is CRUCIAL since Dante has been seperated from his mom and sibs so young. It is IMPERATIVE that Dante meet and greet and play with other friendly dogs and puppies between now and at least 16 weeks of age - dogs/pups are able to teach them things humans can not replicate. Note: They can not be the same core group of dogs and puppies - because the core group then becomes the "pack" and you start to lose the pupose and benefits of true socializing. Same goes for people. Dante needs to meet and greet young people, old people, fat people, skinny people, disabled people, black people, white people, green people, people with hats, moutaches, beards, etc. You can not OVER socialize as long as you do it correctly and it is all in FUN with lots of food; nothing ever scary and nothing ever forced. If Dante does not want to approach the man in the funny hat - do not make him - you will instill life long fear of men in funny hats. Instead have the man get down to Dante's level, have lots of food and encourage Dante to approach at his own speed. You can even throw food towards the man and have Dante approach but tell the man to NOT interact in any way with Dante upon his approach - just the approach is enough.
But I regress (Dante's person if you want a copy of my very verbose puppy packet that I hand out at my puppy classes - email me privately sinbaje@comcast.net and I will send). So - how to teach the pup to "growl" on command. First you have to teach the pup what a marker cue is (such as the clicker or a verbal (and excited) yes!). To do that you click and treat or say yes! and treat multiple times throughout the day for several days - Dante does not have to be doing anything - just standing there while you click/treat yes/treat. Some folks likes to put their pups on leash, then stand on the leash while they do this so the pup can not run off.
Once he knows what the marker is then you can start finding behaviors you want to mark. In this instance the "growl". I assume you have heard the noise before - at 6 weeks I can well imagine that what you are hearing or what you like is when he grrrrs at you in delight or play vs. actual growling at you to tell you to "piss off" - there is a big difference to the intent. Grrrs in fun are rather cute esp. when they kind of stretch their necks up to make it happen - almost a prelude to a chortle. Since, as I said, I assume you have heard this noise before - you will need to think about what brought the noise on to begin with then try and duplicate it. (That said - IF Dante is truly growling to tell you to piss off as he would to a littermate - I would perhaps not mark that but try to encourage him to make happy, playful noises as the last thing you will want is a pushy puppy who thinks you are a sib he can push around.) The minute he makes a happy peep - any peep I would click/treat for the noise and continue to do whatever it is that encourages him to make the noise click/treating for each peep. If at any time he offers it without your encouragement - jackpot him - jackpot to mean many small, successive, treats being fed to him rapidily NOT just a handful for him to chow on. Note: you can also say good "growl or speak" or whatever your cue word will ultimately be as you reward so the word is starting to become associated with the behavior. NOTE - do not ask for the behavior via the cue word in the beginning - you will only teach him to ignore the word. Only pair the word with the food reward AFTER he has offered it. Sequence would be: growl -> click/"good speak" at the same time the treat is given. NOT "Dante speak….Dante speak....Dante speak" while frustration mounts because he is not giving you what you want.
Once he begins offering it more often (ie he is "getting" the idea of what you are wanting and he is getting rewarded for) then you can start to ask him to offer it - but only once. "Dante speak" - if he offers you ANYTHING that remotely looks or sounds like he is speaking or trying to speak - REWARD. If he does not, ignore, do something else then come back to it knowing he is not quite ready to have the cue asked of him. Do not repeat the cue over and over and do not settle - just go on to something else and come back.
I hope this helps. I have had two basenjis that speak on command and it is a fun trick since most people still think basenjis are mute and are amazed they can make "dog noises."
Thank you I haven't started to teach growl and I've heard it just a few times, I just wanted the knowledge you provided in this response and for that I thank you.
You also picked up on the mood of the thread and for that you gained my respect. Thank you, and rest assured i'll provide Dante with the best Care I can.
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Yes, I know all too well how basenji vocalizations can be misconstrued by even the most savvy of dog people - that is however a whole different subject.
Actually, I don't think it is a whole different subject. As owners and trainers of our dogs we really should put thought into how what we are teaching our dogs will effect how others view them. Basenji vocalizations and even their body language are often misconstrued by people. It is important for owners to consider how encouraging a behavior that can be misconstrued as aggression, a label that can get a dog killed, will effect their dog in the long run. Even though the goal is to put it on cue, my dogs will offer all their tricks without a cue trying to get a reward and if their tricks included "growl" they would do that too and not all people are going to think it was a cute parlor trick.
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I agree with lvoss, just remember how many times that it freaks people out when a Basenji raises its hackles…
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We will just have to agree to disagree as your experiences are not the same as mine.
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Dante's person: I have been in contact with someone who has successfully taught their dog to play dead. I have not taught this so was not sure how to approach so thought I would get another view. Here was their reply though it is not too detailed:
"Well that's a good question! It was a variant begun with teaching
roll over; however Nut was good at stopping half-way with her legs
sticking out to the side and head down. It was so cute, and I hadn't added a cue yet, so every time she rolled on her side I pointed my finger and said bang. She was a natural at it, so I never thought much about how we got there. "While teaching a dog to play dead could be deemed as irresponsible in the violent society in which we exist (esp. if you add the finger point and "bang"), I hope others find no offense in your wanting to teach this. I know I find it cute when Nut falls over in a dead heap. :O) Good luck.
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I am under the impression Dante's person has asked the folks how to teach Dante to growl ON COMMAND…
Anyone taking a growl on command to mean anything other then what it is - a cute parlor trick...
Thank you, Ms. Linda, for explaining what I was trying to say.
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Sorry, I have to agree with Lisa. Shadow growls when he is on the couch-we know it is playing, but I've had people over who come, literally, running back to me saying-'he's growling at me.' He is not growling, but play growling but he sounds very nasty about it.
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Sorry Arlene, again - we are again talking major differences here. Shadow growling as you describe above is in a totally different context to what I am discussing and what Dante's person was asking.
EXAMPLE: If I am standing there amongst a group of people and I say "Hey - my dog knows a cool trick - let me show you" And I proceed to give a cue and my dog growls - it is just a trick and nothing more. If someone standing there wants to misconstrue it - I can not control their idiocy, and to be honest - nor should I have to.
The same as if I am standing there with a cookie in my hands and my dogs start to offer me anything and everything including a growl in hopes of earning the reward; it would be quite obvious, even to the most inane person that a) I am working with them (the big hint is the food) and b) the dog is going through their behavior repetoire. It becomes even more obvious when I say something like "Sorry, I did not ask you to growl, I asked for a sit or down or shake or beg or…....." Again - if someone takes that the wrong way - so be it. I am not going to dictate my life or the fun I have with my dogs on such small minded and obviously simple people.
This is not even close to being the same as having someone in my house, sitting next to/standing by/ or approaching my dog and it growls at them.
Putting a behavior on command means just that - you ask them to do something and (with basenjis - hope) they do it in that moment.
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People are stupid, and believe their own misconceptions, rather than common sense.
Blaze was playing with my Hubby's nephew and a ball. The nephew made a high pitch giggle sound that sounded very similar to me when I say "Aroooo". This is Blaze's cue to do his play roo, which tapers off into the playful grr. The nephew's mom (Hubby's cousin) thought that the nice friendly, old, toothless dog who had been playing with her son all weekend, and took a ram in the ribs from the ram to protect her son, was suddenly going crazy…
I can see how he looked so evil with his head ****ed to the side, in the playful bow position (which she was aware of) and wagging his curled tail...
She promply jumped out of the couch and kicked him in the head. He spun around on the hardwood floor, yelping, until he hit the coffee table leg, then he collapsed.
She said she though he was going to attack her kid because he growled. I tore a stripe off of her, and we still don't see eye to eye on the situation.
I have to say though, that while I hate her, I am pretty mad at myself for putting Blaze in that situation. I taught him the cue and didn't think that someone else would trigger it. I am never very far from him, but in this case, I was only in the other room, I could see them through the door, and I still couldn't help him.
Blaze now avoids her like the plague, sometimes he actually growls at her if she attempts to come close to him. When her son approaches him, he moves away... infact, he does this with all children now. He's never growled at them. But he use to love kids. He use to go to the park and play on the slide with them, going down it with them, waiting in line with them. It's heart breaking. This happened over three years ago.
Just consider the what ifs before you decide what to do. -
When people have treats and withhold them, my dogs start offering all of their tricks trying to figure out which trick will get them a treat. So if "growl" was part of their tricks they would probably offer that trying to get a reward. Since mine are show dogs people don't even have to actually have a treat for them to think they do all they have to do is put their hands in their pockets. It may be cute to watch them offer a sit, a down, even a yodel trying to get a treat out of someone. I really doubt a stranger would find it cute if they offered a growl trying to get a treat.
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People are stupid, and believe their own misconceptions, rather than common sense.<<
I think you hit the nail on the head; people are stupid, even the ones you would least expect it from but alas we are confronted with them daily and yet, life goes its merry way.
It does beg the thought though; how Hollywood trainers handle these stupid people?; heck knows their dogs are taught far worse cued behaviors then growling.
Sorry guys - you are not going to convince me that teaching a dog to growl on command will cause all the deleterious effects to which some keep implying. The sky might be falling but not currently at my house. :O)
We will just have to agree that we have differing opines and leave it at that.
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Knipper: Kicked him in the head??? :eek::eek::eek:
I'd have done more than tear just a stripe out of her. My stomach turns to knots just thinking of someone kicking a dog in the head!:mad::mad:
Can't say I blame Blaze at all for growling at her and meaning it.
Too bad about kids, though.
It makes me sad the things folks can do to change a dog's attitude.
