@ElfinSailor:
eeeefarm I assume you went tilt at my opening statement and were unable to read anything else I said fallowing that.
No, I read everything you wrote.
Most people I know consider a dog that follows directions and obeys commands a trained animal. The definition of biddable, if not playing cards, is following directions or obeying commands. Something you agree is is not particularly Basenji like.
With which I totally agree. However, saying they are untrainable is a different thing.
Positive Punishment? Now that is a curious phrase. I am certain if you try using it on my very Alpha partner JaBok You would be unable to be in the same county with him unless you kept him tied up.
Positive punishment, in the Operant vocabulary, simply means something added that tends to diminish the unwanted behaviour. It doesn't have to be severe to be effective, and definitely will work with Basenjis if…...and it is an important "if"......they are absolutely convinced that this consequence will occur every single time they perform the unwanted action. Think horses and electric fence, and you get the picture.
I do agree with the cat in a dogs body analogy. Cats are also pretty much un-trainable.
There are videos on line of cats doing agility obstacles on command. Again, this is using positive reinforcement and will work well for cats…..and Basenjis......if the reinforcement is salient enough.
Most people seem seem to think that a dog that learns to do everything you tell it is smart. I have always felt that dogs that do everything you tell it are kinda dumb and are unable to think for themselves.
There is "smart" (intelligent) and there is "biddable", and it doesn't have to be one or the other. Some dogs…...Border Collies would be a good example......are definitely both. Eager to work with the handler, but capable of working on their own. A good sheepdog is amazing to watch, particularly in a "silent gather', where no help is offered by the handler and the dog must make his own decisions. Basenjis, while not usually biddable, can certainly demonstrate they are intelligent, often while outsmarting their owners! :)
When JaBok and I go out to move the horses from one pasture to another He is right there and knows just what to do. He once saw what I was doing and because of his bond with me he wants to engage and assist. I never taught him any of it.
He sounds like an unusual Basenji. None of mine have been the least bit interested in herding, although I believe we have another member on here who does have Basenjis with such an inclination.
Than I am unable to stop him when he sees a deer and he will chase it until it disappears That is instinct and he does not understand why I don't help him catch it. I would really like it if I could train him not to chase them. It has been ten years now and I have had no success.
Doable but not easy, and would definitely involve consistent positive punishment. If chasing them doesn't put him at risk, why bother?
I am 70 And have worked with lots of dogs and horses with a reasonable degree of success. JaBok is a different story. We do everything together he comes when I call him he usually gets into the truck when I tell him. If he does not want to go he won't get in. I am completely unable to catch him if he really does not want to be caught. He will run to the house though and that tells me he wants to stay home so I let him in. Does he have me trained? If you re-read my previous statement I think you will see that I was attempting to explain how to get that which is Basenji to live in co-existence with you.
Yes, I do understand that. I am not a lot younger than you, and have had 5 Basenjis over a span of 40 plus years. My first was the most like your JaBok. She was the most biddable Basenji I have owned. She would come when called quite reliably, and seemed to care about pleasing me. I wrote about her here:
http://www.basenjiforums.com/showthread.php?11775-quot-You-can-t-do-that-with-a-Basenji!-quot&highlight=
