Doesn't share well
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  • We've had Vince for over a month now and the honeymoon is over. He's still a cuddlebunny and he and Shelby play well together but when they get toys or rawhides, they both want what ever the other one has. Vince is definitely the alpha male so Shelby usually gives up her bone and waits to steal it. Except her treatballs. She's an expert at getting the treats out and loves the things. Vince doesn't really know how to get the stuff out but wants the ball since she has it. Last night they had a actual fight over the treat ball. Usually I catch the argument before it gets to teeth but last night I wasn't paying attention. Both dogs are fine now and we separated them pretty quickly so only one small laceration on Shelby lip but my big question is will they ever get over wanting what the other has? Honestly we give them both a treatball at the same time. And all other toys and bones are the same for both. I had two boys so I know that everything has to be the same:D Any suggestions? They don't get snarky over the food dish, just chewable stuff. And Vince seems to be "claiming the family room" his. Shelby sneaks in and lays on the couch but keeps an eye on him.

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  • Seems a little too soon to even chance something with treats that don't get eaten right away. Some dogs probably could eventually be comfortable sharing those types of things…but my guess would be a no for most basenjis...of course, yours are tempered by a different breed as well. But there is not a snow ball's chance in you know where that I could put a treat ball with something they wanted to eat in a room with mine and expect there wouldn't be some arguing leading to fighting over it. Even if I put five balls in for four dogs...they would all want the same one...always...dog law....

    I would still use the treat balls, but separate them..one inside, one outside, or different rooms, or whatever. I hope they sort stuff out.

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  • Our Basenji is very alpha. Even if we give him something first and then Sissy. He drops his and takes hers. She is very submissive so she just runs over and takes what he didn't want. That took time though. There were several knock-down drag out fights for the first few months. I feel your pain. good Luck!

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  • I had no idea that they would fight over stuff like this. Only had one dog at a time before. I will try the separate rooms or in the crates thing. For a while today they were separated but both wanted to be with the other and didn't chew on any of their toys. They just kept going to the door and touching noses. This is my first time with a male dog too so I've had a lot to learn. :eek: Vince is still my cuddlebunny though even if he is very much a boy. He loves to roll in the grass and get dirty. Shelby just looks at him like he's a nut case. She wouldn't be caught dead getting dirty. :)

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    @SweetShelby:

    I had no idea that they would fight over stuff like this. Only had one dog at a time before. I will try the separate rooms or in the crates thing. For a while today they were separated but both wanted to be with the other and didn't chew on any of their toys. They just kept going to the door and touching noses. This is my first time with a male dog too so I've had a lot to learn. :eek: Vince is still my cuddlebunny though even if he is very much a boy. He loves to roll in the grass and get dirty. Shelby just looks at him like he's a nut case. She wouldn't be caught dead getting dirty. :)

    We've always given chews in the crates. The older dogs, if you hand them a chew, they want to go to their crate with it.

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  • @SweetShelby:

    I had no idea that they would fight over stuff like this. Only had one dog at a time before. I will try the separate rooms or in the crates thing. For a while today they were separated but both wanted to be with the other and didn't chew on any of their toys. They just kept going to the door and touching noses. This is my first time with a male dog too so I've had a lot to learn. :eek: Vince is still my cuddlebunny though even if he is very much a boy. He loves to roll in the grass and get dirty. Shelby just looks at him like he's a nut case. She wouldn't be caught dead getting dirty. :)

    When mine fight over "things" they usually make up pretty easily. It is the status fights that are more difficult, in not impossible to overcome. I do everything I can to keep a "resource" fight from happening, because if there is a struggle for status, a resource fight can turn into a very serious status fight.

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  • How does a status fight start? What brings it On? Shelby has always been submissive and when they play, Vince will roll on his back to her too so I'm hoping the status thing has already been worked out.

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    @SweetShelby:

    How does a status fight start? What brings it On? Shelby has always been submissive and when they play, Vince will roll on his back to her too so I'm hoping the status thing has already been worked out.

    I've seen an ugly fight start over which one of our female's got to go out the door first.

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  • I subscribe to the theory that status (or dominance) in dogs is very flexible instead of rigid (like wolves). Dogs can be of different status at different times and places. For instance, we have two dogs that will fight immediately in the house…but they will happily walk for miles next to each other on a walk. It can chage due to life changes...a sick dog will be challenged for status immediately...a bitch in heat will be very protective of her status. Some dogs couldn't care less about status...some can't think about anything else. Things that provoke status fights are usually about space....the best sleeping spot, the best sun spot. And they are easily triggered when dogs are aroused...so when they are jostling around at the door waiting to come in ou out. Sometimes a status fight will be brewing for a while...and if you are attuned to it you can see...a lot of staring at each other,a lot of stiffening when the dogs approach or pass each other...sometimes there are very few calming signals being given (turning head, licking)...I think the reason you don't see the calming signals is that both dogs really would like to have it out to see who really does have the higher status. It seems like the fight comes out of nowhere.

    Sometimes one dog doesn't really want to fight, they just want the other dog to stop seeking higher status...so then you will see a lot of calming signals, lick lipping, lip curling, growling and a fight can be averted either by the dogs, or human intervention.

    Personally, I don't have any experience with a male/female pairing having relentless status fights...I would imagine it isn't too common....most opp. sex pairings can sort out their place pretty easily. And often one of the dogs will guard resources against the other...but that doesn't really have all that much to do with status, particularly if the dogs do sometimes trade back and forth.

    That's my take on it...I am no expert, but I do a lot of reading :)

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    @Quercus:

    I subscribe to the theory that status (or dominance) in dogs is very flexible instead of rigid (like wolves). Dogs can be of different status at different times and places. For instance, we have two dogs that will fight immediately in the house…but they will happily walk for miles next to each other on a walk. It can chage due to life changes...a sick dog will be challenged for status immediately...a bitch in heat will be very protective of her status. Some dogs couldn't care less about status...some can't think about anything else. Things that provoke status fights are usually about space....the best sleeping spot, the best sun spot. And they are easily triggered when dogs are aroused...so when they are jostling around at the door waiting to come in ou out. Sometimes a status fight will be brewing for a while...and if you are attuned to it you can see...a lot of staring at each other,a lot of stiffening when the dogs approach or pass each other...sometimes there are very few calming signals being given (turning head, licking)...I think the reason you don't see the calming signals is that both dogs really would like to have it out to see who really does have the higher status. It seems like the fight comes out of nowhere.

    Sometimes one dog doesn't really want to fight, they just want the other dog to stop seeking higher status...so then you will see a lot of calming signals, lick lipping, lip curling, growling and a fight can be averted either by the dogs, or human intervention.

    Personally, I don't have any experience with a male/female pairing having relentless status fights...I would imagine it isn't too common....most opp. sex pairings can sort out their place pretty easily. And often one of the dogs will guard resources against the other...but that doesn't really have all that much to do with status, particularly if the dogs do sometimes trade back and forth.

    That's my take on it...I am no expert, but I do a lot of reading :)

    We've never had two males fight…...just the females. We've learned to watch for "status" issue signs especially with the Af female and it's kept things calmer, but we had to learn those things......sometimes the hard way.
    Adjusting to the Basenji, we've certainly done that......had to.

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  • I certainly have had males fight… and females also, but typically with male/female combo's they get along...
    I would also have to say that your pair have not been together long enough to really have sorted things out... and when mine wereyoung the only place they got things like chews were in their crates... that is when all the fighting started, cause you know there is only "one" good one even if you put down 10 for 5 Basenjis...LOL.....

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  • Basenji Mix

    @tanza:

    … and when mine wereyoung the only place they got things like chews were in their crates... that is when all the fighting started, cause you know there is only "one" good one even if you put down 10 for 5 Basenjis...LOL.....

    I am learning this too. My two argue over the new chewy's. I have purchased quite a few but hesitate to give them any. I am going to give them their treats in crates. :) (So much to learn . . .) Thanks!

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    @tanza:

    I certainly have had males fight… and females also, but typically with male/female combo's they get along...

    I know males will fight and it can be ugly…...with two in tact males, I watch carefully and wouldn't rule out they may need separated somewhere down the line.

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  • Interesting however that 99% of the time you can get males back together.. different from bitches that once the blood is drawn, it is over for life…

    My fights were with an intact young male and an older neutered male.. the young male was a "wantabe"... and within a few hours they would go back to existing quite nicely with each other... but bitch fights can be deadly....

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  • I recently read "males fight to win, bitches fight to kill" ….sad, but so often true....

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  • @Quercus:

    I recently read "males fight to win, bitches fight to kill" ….sad, but so often true....

    Exactly.. and it is sad… but true!!!

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  • Thanks for the good advice. They are getting along fabulously now but I know that being shelter dogs there may be more issues that come up. Treatballs are only given in the crates now. Interesting all the information about the real status fights and what to look for. So far Shelby is usually submissive to Vince. I've seen both dogs do the licking the lips and looking away thing when the other had a bone but never realized that they were communicating. I figured they were waiting to steal it. Stealing is a favorite game with these two.:) I also wonder if the weather and other circumstances in the house contribute to how they get along. Some days they just seem calmer and other days Vince acts like a bully. I figure we all have our good days and bad days.

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    @Quercus:

    I recently read "males fight to win, bitches fight to kill" ….sad, but so often true....

    Sadly, I've experienced that first hand more than I want to. The last fight we had to break up, (Cleo and Raven), Cleo's mate Max thought he needed to jump in…...it was very scary. Raven ran past someone opening a gate to an area of the house that is Cleo's and Max's territory........it wasn't pretty at all. Raven is the smallest Basenji we have and Max and Cleo are the biggest.:(

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  • When I have had serious bitch to bitch fights it was interesting that the other bitches and my male would join in…. however, if it was a male to male fight, the bitches didn't even bother to get up from nap

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    @tanza:

    When I have had serious bitch to bitch fights it was interesting that the other bitches and my male would join in…. however, if it was a male to male fight, the bitches didn't even bother to get up from nap

    That's funny and so believable!:D :D :D Go ahead guys, knock yourselves out.:D :D

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  • @Basenji_Boy:

    That's funny and so believable!:D :D :D Go ahead guys, knock yourselves out.:D :D

    Exactly!!!!

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