Neutering to reduce anxiety?

[tanza]

While I respect your choice to leave him in-tact… honestly.. if you talk to many US breeders they would advise you to just have him neutered... it really is a pretty easy recovery for them... I have always had mine done when we are finished showing.. and if interested in breeding just had them collected. Basenjis are noted for knowing breeding season, regardless of what is around them... and then add in possible other breeds in season.. and you really have a problem depending on the dog. Some don't really care, others become basket cases if the smell a bitch in season.... IMO.. there is no reason to keep a pet in-tact unless you are showing or wanting to breed.. and if even wanting to breed, there is always collection and frozen.

[lvoss]

Here is my experience with my boy. Nicky was intact until he was 7 years old. Anytime there was a bitch in season in my neighborhood he would have increased anxiety to some extent or another. During rut, he would eat 4-5 times his normal amount of food and still lose weight because he was burning so many calories. He has never marked, he has only humped when my girls are in standing heat, nor he did not show other behaviors you may consider typical problems of an intact dog. What he did do was lick things, chew, pace, and was just plain tense. Since being neutered, his weight is stable, he is more relaxed, if he is frustrated he will still do the licking, chewing, pacing things but usually a nice long walk or a good training session fixes that. He is a happier dog overall without the hormones running the show.

[sharronhurlbut]

These 2 post tell you from 2 professional breeders…you might want to rethink your keeping this boy intact.
Not your your comfort, but more for his.

[Kananga]

@sharronhurlbut:

These 2 post tell you from 2 professional breeders…you might want to rethink your keeping this boy intact.
Not your your comfort, but more for his.

I appreciate the additional advice, although there is plenty of research out there that negates the possible behavioral benefits of having a dog neutered.

Having the dog put under alone is a slight risk. It's not exactly common for a dog to pass away after having local anesthesia, but it happens. There are health risks having a dog neutered as well as leaving them intact.

I'm not going to get into a lengthy debate over this, but I'm not unfamiliar with this topic. I created the thread to pinpoint the issue with recent anxiety. If the DAP is effective then I won't have any issues. He's a perfect dog outside of that one isolated problem. I would consider neutering if it was a 100% certainty that it would rid him of his increased anxiety. Although no one can be certain.

Now if he were mounting everyone in sight and creating serious frequent problems, I'd have him neutered immediately. ;)

[lvoss]

IMO, the obnoxious behavior that you are using as a marker that neutering is neccessary is something that effects the human more than the dogs whereas the anxiety issues are something that seriously impact the dog but don't necessarily always reach a level where they significantly impact the human. No one can give you a garuntee that neutering will make a difference even if he were humping everything in your house there is no garuntee that neutering will change that behavior. My male still humps when my girls are in standing heat. If you are waiting for 100% assurance to make a decision you will never get it.

My experience with DAP is that when Nicky's anxiety levels were low it helped, during breeding season it took the edge off but he was still losing weight and demonstrating anxiety behaviors.

[sharronhurlbut]

Its always a personal decision. IMO, it will make your dog a better pet.

[tanza]

@Kananga:

I appreciate the additional advice, although there is plenty of research out there that negates the possible behavioral benefits of having a dog neutered.

Having the dog put under alone is a slight risk. It's not exactly common for a dog to pass away after having local anesthesia, but it happens. There are health risks having a dog neutered as well as leaving them intact.

I'm not going to get into a lengthy debate over this, but I'm not unfamiliar with this topic. I created the thread to pinpoint the issue with recent anxiety. If the DAP is effective then I won't have any issues. He's a perfect dog outside of that one isolated problem. I would consider neutering if it was a 100% certainty that it would rid him of his increased anxiety. Although no one can be certain.

Now if he were mounting everyone in sight and creating serious frequent problems, I'd have him neutered immediately. ;)

As already said, nothing will be with 100% certainty that neutering him will make a total difference… you are the only one that can make that decision... however that said, why would you want to even expose him to the possibles?, if you have no intention of ever breeding him?...and bring into the conversation about cancer that is a concern in male dogs?.. I well understand the difference with the US and our decisions to neuter compared to the thoughts from overseas... however there is nothing in life that can be considered 100%.

[nomrbddgs]

I'll tell you my experience with NOT neutering. (Yes it is a personal choice). I had this male years ago. I wanted to breed him so kept him intact, by age 3 he had prostatitus 3 times, almost losing him totally twice, trips to the ER, to the tune of over $1200 each time. (don't forget, this was about 20-25 years ago, can you imagine the cost now? Yikes) Months of recuperation in between, only to fall victim again. I did end up having to neuter him anyway, and could not collect him because he had holes in his prostate gland. I always neuter now, I would rather have a different set of issues that prostatitus again.

[Janneke]

Well.. you all know how I feel about neutering.. And I believe Kananga already read enough about the subject to make a decision for herself..

So only on-topic here.. I don't really think the anxiety is from bitches in heat. If he's really only showing this behaviour when you're leaving, I would think he doesn't like to be left alone.. so probably a minor case of sep. anxiety.. I would definitely try to address this, more then neutering him.

[Quercus]

@Janneke:

Well.. you all know how I feel about neutering.. And I believe Kananga already read enough about the subject to make a decision for herself..

So only on-topic here.. I don't really think the anxiety is from bitches in heat. If he's really only showing this behaviour when you're leaving, I would think he doesn't like to be left alone.. so probably a minor case of sep. anxiety.. I would definitely try to address this, more then neutering him.

I agree. As much as I am in favor of neutering non-breeding animals, I don't think this issue has to do with hormones. I think it is low grade anxiety. I think the suggestions of DAP and Patricia McConnell's book will get you on the right track. Also, keep in mind that something frightening or startling may have occurred when you weren't at home, and it will take some time for him to get past whatever it was.

[Kananga]

@Janneke:

Well.. you all know how I feel about neutering.. And I believe Kananga already read enough about the subject to make a decision for himself..

So only on-topic here.. I don't really think the anxiety is from bitches in heat. If he's really only showing this behaviour when you're leaving, I would think he doesn't like to be left alone.. so probably a minor case of sep. anxiety.. I would definitely try to address this, more then neutering him.

;)

Right. That's why I feel the DAP is worth a shot before I'd considering neutering. I'm glad someone recommended that first. Having him neutered is the last resort. Of course i'm biased because I too am a male, but it's hard to know if he will truly be happier once neutered. While I'm at home he's relaxed and happy. I never hear him whine or really see him pace unless he hears someone outside of my door, which is to be expected with most active dogs.

Kananga for the most part has been the perfect dog. The only time I think he is truly miserable is when his allergies are bothering him. I do what I can to help decrease the effects but it's something he mostly has to live with. I know it's not food related, I would think medication is the only treatment since it's probably something seasonal.

I suppose the true breeding season (Aug-Oct) will be the ultimate test.

[Quercus]

@Kananga:

;)

Right. That's why I feel the DAP is worth a shot before I'd considering neutering. I'm glad someone recommended that first. Having him neutered is the last resort. Of course i'm biased because I too am a male, but it's hard to know if he will truly be happier once neutered. While I'm at home he's relaxed and happy. I never hear him whine or really see him pace unless he hears someone outside of my door, which is to be expected with most active dogs.

Kananga for the most part has been the perfect dog. The only time I think he is truly miserable is when his allergies are bothering him. I do what I can to help decrease the effects but it's something he mostly has to live with. I know it's not food related, I would think medication is the only treatment since it's probably something seasonal.

I suppose the true breeding season (Aug-Oct) will be the ultimate test.

Just food for thought…it is widely believed that dogs don't regard their own sexuality the way humans do. Most likely, Kananga wouldn't be happier, or less happy if he were neutered...he would have no idea.

I would like to know (honestly, I don't know) what health risks (aside from anesthesia) there are to neutering a dog. We can start a new thread, if you wish...but I am really curious.

[Kananga]

@Quercus:

Just food for thought…it is widely believed that dogs don't regard their own sexuality the way humans do. Most likely, Kananga wouldn't be happier, or less happy if he were neutered...he would have no idea.

I would like to know (honestly, I don't know) what health risks (aside from anesthesia) there are to neutering a dog. We can start a new thread, if you wish...but I am really curious.

In regards to him being unchanged with happiness, that's my point. If it makes no difference with him then why do some people say he will be happier?

With what i've read, these were the most common results in studies (to name a few):

-3x risk of hypothyroidism (my vet has also confirmed this with me)
-Increases the risk of progressive geriatric cognitive impairment
-3x risk of obesity
-Increases the risk of prostate cancer (albeit there's an obvious reduction in testicular cancer)
-Increases the risk of bone cancer
-General physical complications with the surgery (small percentage, but still a risk)

[renaultf1]

@Kananga:

In regards to him being unchanged with happiness, that's my point. If it makes no difference with him then why do some people say he will be happier?

I think they are saying he'd be happier because he won't be a slave to his hormones…he'd be more balanced that way and less anxious when there is a dog in season.

[Basenjimamma]

I agree with the posts stating he might not necessarily be happy just because you have him neutered. Give the DAP an honest try and if that doesn't work try some other things before you jump into conclusion that a neuter is a cure all. I feel, like you that this is a personal issue between you and Kananga. I haven't done the research about pros and cons of neutering but seeing what you wrote about the hypothyroidism and all that I will. I have had 2 other dogs in the past and they were both neutered, one of the became very overweight regardless of what I fed him ( well, that is not true, when he was on Barf he did great), and my other dog got hypothyroidism and cancer (brain though).
Good luck, and keep us updated on how he turns out on the DAP.

Petra

[Kananga]

@renaultf1:

I think they are saying he'd be happier because he won't be a slave to his hormones…he'd be more balanced that way and less anxious when there is a dog in season.

To which I do honestly understand. But with a more balanced nature, the 3x risk of hypothyroidism could mean one problem fixed and one problem created.

That's how I look at it.

[tanza]

@Kananga:

In regards to him being unchanged with happiness, that's my point. If it makes no difference with him then why do some people say he will be happier?

With what i've read, these were the most common results in studies (to name a few):

-3x risk of hypothyroidism (my vet has also confirmed this with me)
-Increases the risk of progressive geriatric cognitive impairment
-3x risk of obesity
-Increases the risk of prostate cancer (albeit there's an obvious reduction in testicular cancer)
-Increases the risk of bone cancer
-General physical complications with the surgery (small percentage, but still a risk)

I totally disagree with the 3x risk of obesity… my males that were neutered were never over weight, nor were my bitches. Basenjis are quite pre-disposed to hypothyroidism, neutered or not, spayed or not.... and while as said there are pros and cons on both side, you could make the case for each one of them on both sides of the fence. So it is up to each person to make the decision that works for them. For me, as a breeder, I am quite comfortable with my decisions to spay/neuter and to place all pets on spay/neuter contracts.

[renaultf1]

@Quercus:

I would like to know (honestly, I don't know) what health risks (aside from anesthesia) there are to neutering a dog. We can start a new thread, if you wish…but I am really curious.

This is a link that I found pretty interesting on this topic. BTW, I'm not advocating one way or another…I just found this article interesting.
http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/LongTermHealthEffectsOfSpayNeuterInDogs.pdf

My only opinion on this matter is this: as much responsibility as it is to have a pet - period, it is even that much more responsibility to have an intact animal…especially when it comes to making sure that it doesn't get free and isn't allowed to roam or run unsupervised...

[Kananga]

@tanza:

I totally disagree with the 3x risk of obesity… my males that were neutered were never over weight, nor were my bitches. Basenjis are quite pre-disposed to hypothyroidism, neutered or not, spayed or not.... and while as said there are pros and cons on both side, you could make the case for each one of them on both sides of the fence. So it is up to each person to make the decision that works for them. For me, as a breeder, I am quite comfortable with my decisions to spay/neuter and to place all pets on spay/neuter contracts.

Risk is simply that, it's risk. It varies by breed but the research done was with various breeds and multiple dogs.

I'm not in any way saying neutering is bad. My point is that leaving a dog intact is not 100% wrong. It's a marginal difference when you weigh our the risks and benefits for both cases. Some may say neutering imposes more risk, some may say leaving them intact imposes more risk.

I agree with you about going with what works best for them. For me, Kananga will never be out in the open on his own. There's no social risk. So it all comes down to behavior/health.

I don't fault anyone for their decisions, unless its a dead giveaway that it was a poor choice (i.e. leaving a male intact that is around intact females unsupervised and no intentions of breeding).

[Kananga]

@renaultf1:

This is a link that I found pretty interesting on this topic. BTW, I'm not advocating one way or another…I just found this article interesting.
http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/LongTermHealthEffectsOfSpayNeuterInDogs.pdf

My only opinion on this matter is this: as much responsibility as it is to have a pet - period, it is even that much more responsibility to have an intact animal…especially when it comes to making sure that it doesn't get free and isn't allowed to roam or run unsupervised...

That is one of my sources of information.

Precisely.