And as I remember, weren't you having these problems a while back with Chance?
Here is a link to the thread
http://www.basenjiforums.com/showthread.php?t=1945
Your right I remember that now, so it's been 5 1/2 months and he reverted from the training then?
I wish you guys could go out on "Basenji" call and work with problem owners & dogs (like myself)
Here is a link to the thread
http://www.basenjiforums.com/showthread.php?t=1945
I had forgotten about that Pat. Good point. It illustrates that you have to complete any training beyond where the dog stops doing the behavior…but you have to keep up on it, and put a replacement behavior in place.
I would really work on the end result being the ability to call Chance away from his food (and other items guarded). Vanessa, you really will need to buy one of the books, and follow the whole protocol, or find yourself a trainer/behaviorist familiar with the methods in the books I mentioned. You don't want to do this kind of training half-way, because you can end up with the problem only partially fixed. I don't mean that you would intentionally do it half-way...but it can be kind of complicated for people who are new to training.
Well put Andrea, and even today with my guys at their advance ages, I can still get them from their food if I need to.. (notice I don't say "call" as they are all pretty much deaf..ggg)… and I can still "exchange" for what they have. It is something that never stops.. reinforcement of the proper behavior. And Vanessa, you really need to start asap with thinking about bring another pup into the mix, especially a bitch... as they are what the name suggests!
It is true that a lot of people stop training once they see the behavior has stopped and do not follow through until the end. The trainer that I go to has stopped offering 8 week, 10 week, 12 week, etc classes because she felt it gave the misleading belief that after a certain period of time a group of behaviors could be mastered rather than conveying that training is an ongoing process.
In the 3 years that I have been taking classes with her, we have had the opportunity to try different methods to work on the same behaviors to help develop reliable behavior. Some things the dogs have picked up much quicker than others and we still find some situations where everything seems to fall apart. The days when my 10 year old suddenly forgets how to sit even though that is one of his default behaviors.
I use trading up in my house and we also have worked with the dogs on Levels method of teaching leave it though we are sort of stuck between Level 2 and 3. Some of that is also that stay is a concept that my basenjis really struggle with and Leave It is related to Stay since both are about self control. We have also done hand feeding with all our dogs which I think has also helped a lot with all of our training endeavors.
Your absolutely right. A while back Chance exhibited the same behavior and we immediately started to hand feed him and sit next to him while he ate. He slowely turned around…(now this is where I made the mistake) We stopped the training. We thought he was a good pup and all was well. Guess not! Our B outsmarted us again! This time now he is getting more vicious. He never gave me the evil eye. Really, the look is quite scarry. Its not just food though that makes him nasty. I leaned down to take him over to his bed and he about snapped at me.
A HUGE concern though is when we go to put him in his crate. He hates his crate. He knows our routine and right before crate time he runs and hides in the corner. Its quite sad. He will cowl in the corner looking up at us with those big brown eyes giving us every sad look he can give. Lately he growls when we lean down to pick him up. We have tried to "trick" him by making him think he isn't going to the crate but he knows. We have used treats, food and toys to try to lure him in but he is stubborn.
Lastly...do you think adding a "bitch" to the mix is such a good idea? Now im really worried!
I will go back to the training and will get the book. We are just so surprised that he is exhibiting this behavior. He has always been so loving and friendly. Is like he has warped into this beast at times!
I use trading up in my house and we also have worked with the dogs on Levels method of teaching leave it though we are sort of stuck between Level 2 and 3. Some of that is also that stay is a concept that my basenjis really struggle with and Leave It is related to Stay since both are about self control.
When do you think these two commands should begin to be taught to a pup? I already have Dallas learning sit, look, & down but everytime I try leave it or stay he just doesn't comprehend AT ALL. He is only 11 weeks today so is that too young to expect him to even understand these or should I just keep at it?
When do you think these two commands should begin to be taught to a pup? I already have Dallas learning sit, look, & down but everytime I try leave it or stay he just doesn't comprehend AT ALL. He is only 11 weeks today so is that too young to expect him to even understand these or should I just keep at it?
The leave it command, IMO, should be started immediately, they are never too young to learn… while their attention spam is pretty short... still it should be started right away.
Think of it this way, when your pup "chews" on something that is not appropriate, what do you do? You tell them no and give them something that they can chew on... no different then the "leave it" command...
And everyone with a new puppy should be working with their pup as far as being able to take that food away...
Also the key to any training is being consistent… and not giving in.... If you ask for the leave it command, don't stop till they did it... look for the first sign that they are "getting" the idea and then praise, praise and mor praise. And it doesn't always have to be food motived... again as always IMO...
For Vanessa, I think that the "leash" idea is a great one, then you do not have to try and put your hands on him... you can use the leash and then you don't give him the opportunity to even try to "bite". How much time is Chance spending in a crate? Can you try and xpen instead?
You can begin immediately with both trading up and Leave It. Anytime your pup is chewing on something you don't want them to chew on, trade them for something they should chew on. Also when they are chewing on those really good things trade them something really yummy for that thing so they learn that you give really good things for them to give you what they already have.
As for Leave It, we just start with a treat in my hand, I make a fist around the treat show them my fist and as soon as they stop nosing, pawing, trying to get the treat and back off, I then say take it and give them the treat. This will progress to them seeing a treat on my open hand and not taking it without permission, to seeing food on a table or on the ground and not taking it without permisssion (this is the place we are stuck at).
For Stay, I have used many different techniques and have found that my dogs "get" 300 hundred peck method best. We start with a sit, click treat, then sit count 1, click treat, sit count 1,2, click treat, and just build time. If they break position what sit, down, stand, whatever you are working on then just go back to the beginning. For pups holding still is really hard so make sure the training sessions are short and they are rewarded with a chance to move at the end.
The crate is between 7 and 8 hrs a day. Nothing more. In a perfect world we would be able to spend as much time with him as possible but we both work. he gets a good long walk when we get home and lots of attention.
Once we move into our new house next week we will be putting chance in the laundrey room instead of a crate. That way he will have more room to move around.
Allowing him to just rome the house is not an option. His safety comes first and he can't be trusted…not to mention our furniture is too expensive.
We have used a leash in the house and he has chewed right through it! It literally took him a minute to chew through a 60 dollar rope which I purchased at Nationals. GGGGRRRRRR. You just can't look away for one minute. They are watching every move you make. Once you turn your head....its free game. Ha!
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Try getting a cheap length of marine cord, and a snap clip at the home depot, or whatever. Soak it in bitter apple...voila 
Crating - get a copy of Susan Garrett's new dvd (or VHS, I guess you can find it in VHS) "Crate Games". Start retraining with a different type of crate (if you've been using plastic, start the crate games with a wire crate. I would not suggest soft crates for obvious reasons)
Have you had his thyroid checked? In order to modify behavoir, you MUST make sure the dog is sound and healty.
Go to dogwise.com and look around for a good book, or two. "Mine" or "Fiesty Fido" come to mind. Also one of Dunbar's books/video address resource guarding, but I don't remember which.
Leave a leash on. Go buy a cheap nylon leash and put something yucky on it - bitter apple, deodorant, vick's vapor rub, palmolive all come to mind. You may need to rub it on every day, maybe twice a day. Do not put the leash on with a corrective collar (ie - choke chain). The problem is, if he bites you and you back off or escalate, you've just made your mountain 10X bigger.
Make sure he's getting enough exercise - physical AND mental. My young dogs (Zpuppy and the malinois) have most of their dinner in a food/puzzle toy. I really like a lot of what's in Control Unleashed. I think, especially if you see behavior problems other than resource guarding, the mat work is great for impulse control. The mat work is based (or is?) on Dr Overall's relaxation protocal. I'm wondering if you will start seeing issues in other areas. And my guess would be overflow behaviors would be related to impulse control. (I wonder if anyone has related resource guarding to impulse control. They seem related in my mind.)
Start teaching him to switch for higher value foods. While you are doing this, don't react if he gets hold of a high value food unless it is toxic to dogs (chocolate and the like). You need to know his hierarchy of values.
If you feel like you are way in over your head, recognize that. It's okay. If you don't feel comfortable learning from books/dvd's. That's okay too. Different people learn differently. Find a good positive trainer to help you out. That's better than wondering around in the dark.
Lately he growls when we lean down to pick him up. We have tried to "trick" him by making him think he isn't going to the crate but he knows. We have used treats, food and toys to try to lure him in but he is stubborn.
We have learned to make his crate a very positive experience- give him exceptional trwats when he goes to his crate on his own. Also buy some really comfy bedding to make it special, maybe something that already he likes and sleeps on, that has his scent on it. Also do it without locking him in and throw treats in his crate or a chewy that he can sit down and eat in his crate.
We have done this and our one dog jumps her crate all the time expecting another/ treat.
I find "making" a basenji do something he does not want promotes anger and a confrontation. With a treat it makes it positive, they will want to do it for the reward & everyones happy. Now we just use their food instead of treats. Our Tri sometimes refuses unless he gets a really special treat sometimes when being pig headed.
A HUGE concern though is when we go to put him in his crate. He hates his crate. He knows our routine and right before crate time he runs and hides in the corner. Its quite sad. He will cowl in the corner looking up at us with those big brown eyes giving us every sad look he can give. Lately he growls when we lean down to pick him up. We have tried to "trick" him by making him think he isn't going to the crate but he knows. We have used treats, food and toys to try to lure him in but he is stubborn.
This is also a training issue. I have one who dislikes his crate but he never got to the point of growling when asked to go in his crate. I still haven't had a chance to try "Crate Games" but I do hope to. It is hard to recondition a dog that has already learned a behavior but it can be done. Since you say that in your new house you will be establishing a new routine, now is a good time to get your "game plan" together for how you can establish a positive association with the laundry room of your new house for Chance.
Lastly…do you think adding a "bitch" to the mix is such a good idea? Now im really worried!
I will go back to the training and will get the book. We are just so surprised that he is exhibiting this behavior. He has always been so loving and friendly. Is like he has warped into this beast at times.
Whether you add a puppy now or later, you will still need to do training. The difference is if you add a puppy, you will also need to train her.
I had this same problem with Willie. I worked with a dog behaviorist and it helped alot. One of the things she taught me was to make myself a resource to the dog. As a younger dog, I could always walk up and take his food bowl while he was eating with no problem. We did it to try and prevent food guarding. He actually used to let one of the cats eat his food first. But he got to the point where you couldn't go near him while he was eating. (He was getting picked on all the time by our other dog - we've always wondered if that was what stared the aggression.)
We changed his eating space to his crate (he used to eat in a corner in the kitchen, but I was afraid if anyone walked near him, he would bite). Then, while he was eating, the trainer had me walk past the crate (he would growl - pretty scary) and drop something into his bowl that was a special treat and I was not to look at him or speak to him - just walk by and drop the treat. I did this day after day. Over time (it takes patience) he stopped growling at me (and my girls - but he still picks on my husband, but my husband doesn't make himself a resource). I can actually stick my hand in his crate and take his bowl (while empty - I haven't tried with it full) without him doing a thing.
The other kind of guarding - for things that he gets by accident - that still continues, but less and less, although I don't trust him fully. He has been trained to go in his crate very willingly because he always gets a treat when he does. If he has something I don't want him to have I tell him to "get in your crate!" which almost always works the first time. He gets his treat, I close the crate, and then I clean up the mess without any worry.
None of this happend overnight, but he went from a dog I trusted and loved to a dog I loved who scared me for my whole family. And now he's soooo much better - not perfect, but almost back to the dog he was in the beginning. It's an on-going process - things had gotten so bad that we worried he might need to be put down and I didn't feel that I could do that unless I tried everything possible beforehand. (We also did all the off the couch, no more sleeping in the bed stuff as well, and we use a spray bottle as a deterent - he's not allowed to come near us while we eat unless he sits on the floor quietly).
So to sum up, behavior modification worked very, very well for us and we really enjoy our boy again.
Good luck to you!
The other kind of guarding - for things that he gets by accident - that still continues, but less and less, although I don't trust him fully. He has been trained to go in his crate very willingly because he always gets a treat when he does. If he has something I don't want him to have I tell him to "get in your crate!" which almost always works the first time. He gets his treat, I close the crate, and then I clean up the mess without any worry.
For our dog, if it's something like a cookie or pizza, nothing will stop him from devoring it.
