UKC vs AKC

[lvoss]

They are each an organization for registering pure bred dogs. They each put on their own titling events. Both have conformation, obedience, and agility. UKC also has Terrier Races and Weight Pull. The rules and titling requirements differ between the two organizations but they have many similarities. In some breeds UKC is the organization most used and in other AKC is more used. Basenjis are registerable in both. UKC will recognize AKC registered dogs but AKC will not recognize a UKC registered dog.

[kiroja]

Lisa had a good note, but I thought I would expand on things. AKC is the much "bigger" organization, and the main one for most breeds. UKC is more prevelant for the rarer breeds, and that's where a lot of them get their start. One example is Pit Bulls, they are not an AKC registered breed, but there are a ton in UKC. Other breeds that are "big" in UKC are Belgian Turvs, Toy Fox Terriers, and American Eskimos, and so on. Basenjis are primarily an AKC breed, there are probably only a few handfuls that ever do anything with UKC.

UKC's goal is to be more of a "family" organization. At their shows they don't allow professional handlers on a dog at any time, unless they own the dog. And usually it's a bit more casual and the shows are much smaller. They really encourage the juniors and most clubs stop all action when the jrs are being judged so the whole family can watch and cheer them on, and folks are not busy in other rings. Also they don't get as crazy with the grooming, they try to keep the dogs in a bit more of a natural look. And they don't allow bait or toys in the ring, unless each specific judge ok's it at the time. Many judges do these days though.

As for the skinny on Basenjis, it's usually a lot easier to finish a dog in UKC. But a big reason for that is because very few of them show UKC, so you don't have a lot of competition. There aren't "majors" and things like that to earn your title. The closest thing to a major is that there must be at least 3 champs to get a leg towards a grand champ. Some people show UKC because their dogs don't do well in AKC. Others show because it's something extra to do after AKC, since many people can't afford to campaign a special. And I think more and more people are going to shift over to UKC because of AKC's increasing fees and lack of real support for responsible breeders.

But I enjoy them and there's lots of nice folks there. The ring procedure is basically the same, the entry fees are cheaper, and there's usually 2 shows each day. So I like to check them out once in a while when there's a close one or others I know are going. But I'll still focus on AKC.

[lvoss]

@kiroja:

One example is Pit Bulls, they are not an AKC registered breed, but there are a ton in UKC.

Kelly, this is not quite true. Many of the Pit Bulls I see at UKC shows are AKC registered American Stafforshire Terriers. It is a difference in the name the breed is called not that they are not recognized in both organizations. What I have seen here in California is that some breeds got their start in UKC and are very loyal to the organization. It is true though that it is easier for the rare breeds to get recognized in UKC than it is in AKC. AKC requires a breed to have a minimum number of registered individuals before they will recognize them and until then the breed has to have some way of regsitering them.

[MacPack]

Just last week someone asked me the difference between AKC and UKC, I will share this good information with them! I thought AKC was the "real" registry and the UKC was somehow less credible, though a friend with ****ers really liked UKC shows better, she said they were more fun and less "political".

[kiroja]

Lisa, from what I remember they kinda are different breeds, not just a name change. Now whether that's just because the people I've talked to are those wanting something different than what the AKC people have, I dunno. lol Never took the time to delve into things yet. Maybe it's the same thing as the German Shepherd/White Shepherd debate. Wow, there's a breed(s) with some serious issues within and between the different organizations! lol

I thought that the Am Staff and the Pit Bull are similar, but they differ in look/type. Yes I have seen dual registered and dual titled dogs. But my guess was that the different groups kinda split off and created separate breeds, with some folks still able to swing in the middle still somehow. But it seemed like most of the APBT people consider the Am Staff a separate breed with a separate look. (although of course very similar)

I do love the breed, guess I need to make time to sit and get to know them more like I've been wanting to.

[kiroja]

Anne, yes they are usually more fun and laid back and a lot less political.

My personal experience with the Basenji judging thus far in UKC is that they don't seem to have quite as good a foothold on the breed as the AKC judges seem to have. So sometimes showmanship, flashiness, and movement are taken into consideration a little more than they should be. (Well obviously movement is very important.) They don't seem to know as much about the breed type and structure, so I think compare them more to the terrier or sporting body style of dogs they might be more used to seeing. Of course this could just be my area of the country too.

They do seem to love to get to know the breed though! And now that more and more people are toying with UKC, I think they will start to really learn their Basenji standard. And there are quite a few UKC judges that are AKC judges too, so it's not like it's necessarily a foreign thing. lol

[lvoss]

@kiroja:

Lisa, from what I remember they kinda are different breeds, not just a name change.

That is not the same impression I got. At one of the UKC shows here, the APBTs showed first and then left to make their ring time at the AKC show that same day. My repro vet has a tech that breeds them. Hers are being shown in UKC as APBTs and AKC as Am Staffs. Also, UKC will accept AKC registered Am Staffs as APBTs so they don't seem to recognize them as a different breed.

[dmcarty]

Whoa - gotta correct a couple of UKC things here - 1 - there ARE handlers they just put their name on the dog. I know someone who just got a BIS from a judge that they own and show for - not good.
2 - I was encouraged by the UKC with my Podengo Grande who has an incomplete pedigree to just 'fill it in so it's 3 generations' so you know it is not a registry that relys on accuate pedigrees. I also spent some time out east visiting with some Coon hound folks who told me that one of the TOP PRODUCERS of all time in one of their breeds - is a product of 2 different coon hounds - but that UKC thought it was ok because both parents had the required 3 gen pedigree (just different coon hound breeds)

In MN there have been several attempts to start UKC events for conformation and most have eventually failed. There is another one now - and while I don't wish them ill - I'm not going to drive out of my way to get to one either. I do know several people who exhibit and are back yard breeders and puppy mills and I've seen some photos of winners and am amazed that dogs lacking in breed quality and type could win anything. That said there are some wonderful dogs too - but geez - the junk is just overwhelming.

Finally - the UKC has spent not one dime to fight any breed specific legislation they are a for profit organization just like the IABCA and ARBA show venues. (keep in mind again that I have entered in IABCA and have judged in that venue) People show where shows are available.

If you live in the Michigan area - where their headquarters are - you will see a reasonably good show with some dogs of quality - however in the rest of the country - while there are a few 'pockets' they are of limited quality. For some - it is the place to go when you can't win anywhere else, for some breeds (like my podengos) it's the place to go because we are not yet eligible for AKC conformation.

Parent clubs - change standards at will in UKC based on who is in charge and what they happen to have.

So based on some of the rules, the lack of true registry - hard to compare - they have different focus and rules - if you are near one - why not show there good place for getting some experience for you and your dog. If you like doing things like weight pulling or happen to love to do coon hunts - it's the place to be.

Just don't make them out to be more than what they are - in spite of what warts you may think that the AKC has, they are still the only game in town, the only 'true' registry, and the only club that supports the rights of dog owners. A couple hundred conformation shows a year - compared to thousands of shows a year is not even close to the same.

[kiroja]

@lvoss:

That is not the same impression I got. At one of the UKC shows here, the APBTs showed first and then left to make their ring time at the AKC show that same day. My repro vet has a tech that breeds them. Hers are being shown in UKC as APBTs and AKC as Am Staffs. Also, UKC will accept AKC registered Am Staffs as APBTs so they don't seem to recognize them as a different breed.

Hmmm, maybe I was remembering wrong then. Maybe I just remember them talking about a little different "type" between the two registries? For example breeders who focused on AKC dogs' had a little different look to them than those who stick with UKC? Sorta like the difference between a show bred Lab and a field bred Lab. Or maybe I just met some looney breeders around here. lol It's been a few years since I talked to them and looked at their set ups and breed info packets/displays.

[kiroja]

Diana, yes there are wrong doings in UKC, just as there are in AKC. Yes, there are handlers, and I've seen them. And yeah, all they have to do is put their name on the dog. But in general, there is a lot less of that going on. (I had said less political, not non political. lol) At least there are written rules against it. The integrity of the people showing is another story. I guess I can't speak for the people who run the shows either, haven't been to enough. They are truly geared towards owners and family dogs so yeah you're going to get some backyard people and yahoos. lol While AKC has a much more high class stigma to it, there is a lot of crap that goes on at those shows too. I've seen PM dogs that get put with a handler and finish.

An organization is only as good as the people who are involved in it. There are some very respectable people in UKC, but yeah then there are others too! Most of the folks I see at UKC are AKC folks. All the sighthounds I've ever run across have all been AKC people.

Look at AKC, we can prove there are registered dogs with false pedigrees yet they do nothing. And while they're much bigger and stronger, things can be said for a lack of integrity there too, both in the show ring and the registration department. I'm certainly not trying to knock either registry, just point out some impressions and differences of each.