This trip is being arranged around Herding Day on the saturday as Lisa is Shelties / Rough Collies, I don't know what is on the sunday. I have been asked if I would like to go but really need the Group 5 or 2 day We seriously thought about going over on Group 2 day to show but have since decided to let Tico's passport lapse. It's an easy journey and we were thinking of going and doing a quick turn around as spectators. Still thinking about it !!!!
Show in MD May 20th
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Thank-You, I would love more information. I think this could be fun and it's close.
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I believe the rules are 'no un-entered dogs on show grounds'. Now, these rules are not strictly enforced usually…unless you tick someone off, and they report you for having un-entered dogs. And usually the "show grounds" are very specific, and nobody worries much about the parking lots.
Word to the wise, if you bring un-entered dogs don't advertise it.....just be subtle. I don't want to sound "breedist"...there is no reason that a mixed-breed should be singled out, but they will *stand out, as being different, and not entered in the show; and consequently, you could be asked to leave.
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Thanks for the heads up. Unfortunaately my 2 will stand out. If anyone has a phone number I can call to make sure I can bring these two, just pm me if you could. I really want to go to see this but my furbabies come with me! Heck if children can come, why not other dogs?
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It depends on the premium. Some say "dogs must be eligible to be shown". I think that is because when they have clinics some dogs will not be entered but may be on the grounds for the clinic.
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Thanks for the heads up. Unfortunaately my 2 will stand out. If anyone has a phone number I can call to make sure I can bring these two, just pm me if you could. I really want to go to see this but my furbabies come with me! Heck if children can come, why not other dogs?
Well, for one thing dogs can have communicable diseases that don't spread from kids
There is a clause in most show premiums that when you enter a dog, you are responsible for having that dog current on vaccines, and in good health. If someone walks a dog in unentered, there is no guarantee that that dog isn't ill or harboring disease. Of course, that is kind of a goodwill among show folks, that people won't bring a sick dog to shows, but some do. And of course most dogs brought by the public are perfectly healthy.The other concern is that a lot of the general public has no idea how their dogs will behave amongst hundreds of intact dogs, many of whom may be in full blown estrous. Again, lots of visitors with dogs will be perfectly well behaved, but I have seen people walk their dogs onto show grounds using a rope as a leash, and looking for a bitch to stud their dog to….not cool....
And there is a slightly different dog show etiquitte (sp?) for dogs. We don't let our dogs sniff each other, or say Hi, or play around (unless we know the other dogs, and owners VERY well). Show dogs are there to do a job, and many of them take it very seriously (none of mine, ftr :rolleyes: )....it is important that they focus on the job at hand, and not on the other dogs. A lot of non show people are used to the dog park etiquette, where the dogs are encouraged to interact with new dogs. I guess to the outsider, it seems snooty...but there are very real reasons why it is like that.
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Well, I may have been a terrible mother but my dogs are way better behaved than my children were and if they act up, I leave and take them for time out which was not always possible with my boys. I realize there are no guarantees that an unentered dog is healthy and up to date on vaccinations but reality is that the same could be said for entered dogs. It's all on faith and trust. What I really have a problem with is that, I'm sorry if I offend but looking at the rules which I just checked online, that because my dogs are mixes, they can't even come to the area for the unentered dogs because they are not qualified since not pure bred. I'm sorry for ranting but this mindset by the AKC makes me crazy! I support the idea of good breeders, keeping a breed pure with good temperaments and health but the idea that is perhaps unintentionally communicated by the AKC is that mixes are not good enough to even be seen at a dog show is what turns a lot of people off about breeders and "showpeople". I want to come to this show but can't because of this rule and the sad thing is my furbabies are more beautiful than most of the AKC breeds there and in better health.:mad: Maybe next time, when I can leave my pups at home, I can attend but until then, I'll remain the ignoramus that I am.
Sorry again, if I offend but I just have to say my piece. The other reality is that the AKC will never change and my opinion matters little in the grand scheme of things. -
in better health
Just curious why you'd say that? The dogs I see at shows are in excellent health.
but reality is that the same could be said for entered dogs. It's all on faith >>and trust.
True, but there's no way to hold the unentered dogs accountable if there IS a problem because there was no agreement made. If you bring an entered dog that has contagious health problems, at least there could potentially be some legal recourse because those owners did agree to the health regulations.
Also, you have to remember that the AKC shows are essentially a showcase for breeds and breeders. Whether I disagree with the policies or not, I can easily understand why they would not want dogs there that do not represent the standards for AKC recognized breeds. They want people to be able to see and learn about the breeds, not mutts.
I'm a mutt owner – always have been, my two B's are the first purebred dogs I've ever owned -- and it doesn't offend me at all that my other dogs can't go to shows for purebreds.
And with the environment and focus of the dog shows, I don't see where the other dogs would get much out of the experience. They're not there to play. -
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Well....I sure hope that *I didn't give the impression that I think you are an ignoramus...because that was not at all my intention. And I am sorry that you obviously feel hurt by the rules that exclude non-eligible dogs. Just so you are clear, "eligible" means AKC registered...so it is exclusionary towards any dog that is not AKC registered..not necessarily mixed breed. There are purebred dogs out there registered with different registries, and of course the AKC wants to protect their interest, and disallow dogs who are not registered with them.
If defense of the AKC...it is a registry for purebred dogs, and a business...nothing more, nothing less...it isn't making a political statement about what kind of dogs are better or more appropriate for companions and pets. Therefore, the dogs that are ENTERED in AKC events, are AKC registered purebreds. It has nothing to do with being exclusionary towards mixed breeds, or non-AKC registered purebreds based on merit or beauty or behavior or health. Only on registered, documented heritage.
There is discussion currently about the possibility of AKC opening performance events to mixed breeds....I think that would be a great idea, and a clear attempt to reach out to the general public to show that AKC is not all about being snooty and eliteist.
And lastly...everybody knows that their dogs are more beautiful than everyone elses, whether purebred, mix, or whatever. And I completely believe that your dogs may be perfectly well behaved, but the rules are in place not for "good" dog owners, but for those that are completely clueless, or don't know or care how their dogs may act in presence of so many other dogs. -
Here's my humble take on SweetShelby's position. Like many people, we regard our dogs, pure and mix like our own children. We LOVE them! I've only been in 30 years to 4 dog shows. I've seen there are no dogs loose, most are in crates or on the grooming table, some being walked on short leashes to show rings or out for potty. If one hasn't been to a dog show before, I can see the thought to bring your dogs to the show with you - it's a Dog Show!!
Anyway - I wish I could bring my dogs lots of places with me. Heck, I got invited to my nephews wedding and I can't even bring my 9 year old son! He's very disappointed and said "FINE - I don't want to go their stinkin' wedding anyway!" Talk about being offended! He knows what's going on. (No children under the age of 12 years old!)
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Exactly! The dog show environment is not one that a non-showing dog is going to get a lot out of. There's no "free play" area, all dogs are leashed or crated, no one lets the dogs play, sniff, etc.
I can't imagine a non-showing dog is going to enjoy the day–esp if it's used to being able to play with other dogs and not being held away from them -- and would probably be stressed out the whole time.Jazzy loves the shows, but really I think it's just because she gets to spend time with Bryan, her hero. The time she spends waiting in her crate doesn't thrill her.
It is a dog SHOW, as you said. It's not a dog park. And if you go to a few shows, you will see that it's just not a place for dogs that aren't involved. It's not about keeping the "riff-raff" out at all. The policy just makes sense.
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Well we spent the day at the park, enjoying the river and I actually had the opportunity to meet a purebred basenji in my new neighborhood. And her owner got to meet my 2. I realize dog shows are a business and it's not about the dogs. I would've gone to see the dogs and my dogs would have simply been with me, not interacting with the other dogs. But my dogs love to be with me in new situations and whether it's a dog show, horse show, farm show, or movie at the mall, it's new to them and they get to smell new things, hear new sounds and still be with me. I can't take them to the movie at the mall but one would figure a dog show is acceptable. I didn't mean to get all riled up about this. As for health, my dogs were just to the vet and pronounced in excellent health and "absolutely beautiful" by the vet. (granted he problably says this to a lot of proud humoms but I'll take the compliment
). Also because my pups are mixes, I don't have to worry about some of the genetic problems that the purebreds have problems with.It's over now, anyway so I would be interested, if anyone took any pictures, if you could post them. I would love to see the basenjis in particular.
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Yes it is a business and there are people there earning a living, doing what they do for a job and take it very seriously. Like it or not that's what it is.
I would suggest a fun match or even one of the k-9 experience events that are more for fun and or education.
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Well we spent the day at the park, enjoying the river and I actually had the opportunity to meet a purebred basenji in my new neighborhood. And her owner got to meet my 2. I realize dog shows are a business and it's not about the dogs. I would've gone to see the dogs and my dogs would have simply been with me, not interacting with the other dogs. But my dogs love to be with me in new situations and whether it's a dog show, horse show, farm show, or movie at the mall, it's new to them and they get to smell new things, hear new sounds and still be with me. I can't take them to the movie at the mall but one would figure a dog show is acceptable. I didn't mean to get all riled up about this. As for health, my dogs were just to the vet and pronounced in excellent health and "absolutely beautiful" by the vet. (granted he problably says this to a lot of proud humoms but I'll take the compliment
). Also because my pups are mixes, I don't have to worry about some of the genetic problems that the purebreds have problems with.It's over now, anyway so I would be interested, if anyone took any pictures, if you could post them. I would love to see the basenjis in particular.
I totally disagree with your statement that dogs shows are a "business" and it is all about the dogs.. at least for all of us that are owner/handlers or breeder handlers… and they far out weigh the professional handlers. Owner and/or breeders that show do so because they enjoy it AND that they want to show that their Basenji (or any breed) is conformationally correct and of good temperament, and general health... and the conformation ring, or even the Obedience/Rally at shows are what that does. For me as a breeder it is a way to verify that I understand the Basenji Standard as I read it and that I am breeding a correct Basenji according to that standard.... and while I don't always win and every dog is not a show dog it is still a way of seeing and understanding the breed.
And I will add one more thing about mixes, you might think they "will" not get the genetic problems as purebreds, but to me that is totally an incorrect statement. You have the chance of getting "all" the genetic problems of "all" the breeds that are mixed... I am not sure why you would think that you don't have to worry about genetic problems... The ONLY reason that people know about the genetic problems in purebreds is because responsible breeders keep track of them, discuss them, look for cures for them, and make them public for people to learn about and understand.
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And to be very honest, I have seen many mixes at outdoor shows… just visiting, of course again, they can't be sniffing or playing with the other dogs... and very rarely does anyone ever say anything.. as typically shows are on public grounds... indoor shows are a different story, as there is Much less room to move around...
Also as said there are matches and also all dogs are welcome to visit at lure trails, in fact at ours we have lots of mixes that come at the end of the day and let their dogs chase the lure.....
We (show and breeders) are NOT the "nasty stuck up people" we are many times made out to be... BUT we believe in purebred dogs and responsible breeding and that includes people that breed mixes (which are typically by accident) and puppy mills that breed for profit... -
We (show and breeders) are NOT the "nasty stuck up people" we are many times made out to be… BUT we believe in purebred dogs and responsible breeding and that includes people that breed mixes (which are typically by accident) and puppy mills that breed for profit...
IMO, What Tanza say's here is true from my limited experience with the show world.
The breeders are more than likely to answer questions and talk to the spectators, while the people that are in it professionally seem to not have the time for all of that and seem very focused on the task at hand…..winning!Breeders want to educate, and share information and have fun showing dogs. It's not really win at all costs for them......IMO.
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And believe me, there is NO money in showing… none!!!! But it certainly costs much!!!! And while we want to win.... it is about the dogs...
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And I will add one more thing about mixes, you might think they "will" not >>get the genetic problems as purebreds, but to me that is totally an >>incorrect statement. You have the chance of getting "all" the genetic >>>problems of "all" the breeds that are mixed…
LOL, I was just about to say the same thing. I think w/the mixes -- and like I said, my 2 B's are the first purebreds I've ever owned, and my beloved Gypsy is def. a mix -- you have a greater risk of health problems, and often the genetic risks are unknown because you are not sure exactly what the mix may be.
We (show and breeders) are NOT the "nasty stuck up people" we are >>many times made out to be...
I have to agree with that. I'm not a breeder, and not really a "show person", but the breeders/show people I've encountered over the last two years have been friendly, helpful, welcoming, and often have mutts of their own at home!
And they also tend to think their mutts are more beautiful than anyone else's.
The breeders/show people are also just regular "humoms and hudads". -
And believe me, there is NO money in showing… none!!!! But it certainly costs much!!!! And while we want to win.... it is about the dogs...
Yeah, I can show you lot's of $25.00 entry fee payments and a bunch of .50 cent ribbons for the trouble….....gas......food....your time.......Yep, there's no money in it.......none.
Jasper got Reserve Winner this weekend and we did get a rosettee........OK $1.50 for that.:D:D
