@Saving thank you very much for the suggestions!
Weaned too early, no contact with dam
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We did our best in evaluating, even read many posts by this breeder here. She is very knowledgeable, thoughtful and intelligent and we respected her. That is why we do not want to out her here.
There were life reasons why the c-section was done that we understood, even though we disapprove.
Since it was c-section, they all were born the same time, so the much smaller size is anyone's guess, perhaps the conception date?
I say runt only to describe what is clearly a much smaller dog.When we got home we learned her eating habits were odd. She grabbed all she could fit in her mouth and find a quiet space to eat alone. We think she had to do that because the much larger pups must have harassed her. They certainly did while we visited.
She is going directly to a new home, found by the breeder. We have a contract, and even with all of the lies and deceit we are honest people. Except for the contract we would have contacted brat.
We do not know what our future holds in respect to a furry friend. Now is not the time to decide anything, but the idea of an older dog is possible.
Again, We thank everyone for the tips and comments. This is a powerful forum. -
@takoda I was wondering how are you putting the collar on her. Are you reaching over her head to buckle the collar and put the leash on. Some basenjis get very nervous when a person leans over them and then goes over top of their head. It is a very dominate posture to our breed. You might want to try attaching the leash to the collar first then have her come to you while you are sitting and then come up with the collar from the front underneath her neck and put the collar on that way because she might feel a little more secure. To me this sound like a normal puppy. Some of them no matter how they are raised can be fearful at this age. On like other breeds Basenjis go through a lot more fear periods then other dog. This is what has kept them alive in the jungle for so long. You have to realize for a little basenji puppy if they are going to get eaten from something bigger it will be coming in and grabbing them by the back or neck before killing them. So I hope this explains a little on why your puppy is acting the way she is. The Basenji is still a primitive breed and not like other dogs, so in training you need to take this into consideration.
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As I said previously, it is terrific how this community makes every attempt to help. It is with a broken heart that we are returning this puppy.
As to the leash - 90% of the time this puppy is delightful. She pees 16 times a day at 3 months old. Maybe a handful of times she aggressively attacks our hands while unleashing. I walk her outside, take her to the second step upstairs for a better reach to the leash and do the same thing every time. If it was every time or the majority I would agree it is a defensive mindset. It is a small part of the time she just snaps.
Yesterday we were sitting on our deck. She went over under my wife's chair and sat calmly. She then reached up to bite the inside of her leg, and chased her around the deck trying to continue the biting. This should not be normal behavior and is not acceptable in our lives. -
Hello, this is such a sad situation, both for you and the little Basenji girl. Let me tell you, it takes special people to have a Basenji...my story was that rescued my boy from a Basenji rescue, he was 1 1/2 years old, seemed pretty normal until I got him home. I had another Basenji at the time, from the same rescue. The behavior you describe is almost identical to my boy...oMG it took 2 years to turn this little guys head around to trusting me or anything/or anyone! It was like a switch would flip on and he became a lethal weapon!! I did learn that sometimes the food we give our B's is not correct for them and I had to test different "grain free" foods on him. I now found a great freeze dry food by Dr. Marty's, on line only and quite expensive. Anyways, all my patience has been a huge reward! My other girl passed away 1 1/2 years ago at 18...and now I have only my boy, he is now 11yrs, and OMG what a great boy he is...but it did not come easy for me and he attack and bit me so many times. So...as others have said, these kids come with their own set of rules...it is our responsibility to help them figure things out if they are going to be a house companion. I am so sorry you could not find the right trainer ( i am one) that could have been familiar with this breed...I truly hope this little girl finds a home soon.
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Thank you so much.
I know everyone knows how devastating it is to send a beautiful creature back. She is impossible to say goodbye to and impossible to keep.
Comments like this help quite a lot. You helped us make the right choice. We are not trainers and we are not equipped for the probably long and hard process to help her.
it is so sad that even this process of return can be made hard. -
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I totally agree with you regarding this breeder - something has gone badly wrong when a litter terrifies its sibling, The fact that it was small does not mean that the rest will gang up on it. In those circumstances I would not even have the pup leave home unless it was to a very experienced Basenji owner and I would have been in constant touch.
It is very hard to let this puppy go and I do sympathise with you, Takoda but I would never let it go back to its breeder, contract or no contract. I obviously have no experience with BRAT, but from what I have learnt from others, they would have been an excellent choice. A puppy should never be willingly passed from hand to hand like this. If this puppy were my own I couldn't be more worried than I am now.
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I deleted my original post bc I did not want anything to interfere with the transfer of the puppy back to the breeder. Now that I know the breeder, out of respect to both parties, I will say only this, though I have a lot to say through the experience as a breeder of thirty plus year.... There are two sides to every story, before jumping to conclusions based upon one side, please, do your homework, find out who the breeder is, and give the breeder the opportunity to rectify the situation. BRAT is for rescue, a responsible breeder will take their puppy back as this one has.
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@jublie Whoever the breeder is, they are far from a responsible breeder. The original post stated “We love her, and never follow our breeders suggestions, like smack with a rolled up newspaper or other lousy ideas.”
No way can you make the argument that this is a responsible breeder in any way, to attempt to do so insults responsible breeders. Hitting a Basenji with a rolled up newspaper will only damage the dogs respect for you and encourage aggression.
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@jublie - Agree jublie
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@Dagodingo, again one side of the story, after the length of time that I have known this breeder, I have a hard time believing she would suggest hitting a puppy with rolled up newspaper. Having been to her home, if she is guilty of anything, it is not being disciplined enough with her pack. Never, have I have seen her hit her dogs with anything. And what other lousy ideas were mentioned?
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@jublie “ 'Breeder' stated she did not know how long before she weaned the puppies.” “Runt had bite marks on face at 6 weeks” “the 11 year old sire with a tick born disease”.
So many red flags, the argument that the breeder is responsible or knowledgeable is ridiculous, other than if the original poster is a liar.
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@Dagodingo, have you personally talked with the breeder?
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@jublie What does that have to do with anything? If the original poster is a liar and made all that stuff up, then the breeder might be a responsible breeder. However if the original poster is telling the truth then that is not the case.
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I am not calling anyone a liar. I was just wondering if you have the other side of the story?
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@jublie The other side of the story is irrelevant. You can explain all day to me how there are two sides to hitting a Basenji, but the argument is futile. Just because someone believes hitting their dog is fine and justified, does not make it fine and justified.
If what the poster says is true, then the “breeder” encourages people to hit their basenjis with rolled up newspapers. Along with not observing how long the pups were weaned, allowed the pup to stay with the others after the pup had bite marks on its face at six weeks and bred to a dog that has a tick born disease.
One of these alone would make the “breeder” irresponsible. Taken together, if true, this breeder is far from responsible.
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@tanza I agree, smaller isn't a runt. Abnormally small is a runt.
I have never seen stats on runts in basenjis. But I do know they've done research on runts and conception times.
Bitches release eggs once. So yes, you could have fertilization 24 hrs difference, but not much more. Research shows that it has very little impact.
Runts often are ones with genetic/health issues, or placement issues, and sometimes failure to get colostrum in the critical first 4 hrs or even 12, making them open to infections that can slow growth (and is a part of many fading puppies).
"Why do litters have runts?
A dog’s uterus is Y-shaped, and the puppy that develops in the middle of the uterus is normally the farthest from the mothers blood supply and receives fewer nutrients.
So, in a sense, the puppy in the middle is “eating” less than the others, which leads to smaller size, less strength, and in some cases, even health problems."https://www.akc.org/expert-advice/dog-breeding/dog-breeding-tips-for-beginners/
"Was the Runt Conceived Later Than His Littermates?
Probably not. Runt puppies most likely are the same age as their littermates but had poor placentation. Bitches release all their eggs over a 24-hour span. Even if the conception of that small pup occurred later than conception of the other puppies, all pups float around free for 17 days before implantation and formation of the placenta."
Margaret V. Root Kustritz, DVM, Ph.D, DACT, professor of small animal reproduction at the University of Minnesota"here’s a common misconception that runts are conceived later than their full-sized litter mates, so effectively they’re born prematurely.
Whilst it is possible for puppies within a litter to be sired by more than one father, the eggs fertilized later catch up with the other embryos quickly in the very earliest stages of pregnancy....A runt puppy might have failed to develop quickly enough because of a congenital defect which impeded their growth.
Or their placenta might have embedded in an unfavorable spot on their mum’s uterus, so they didn’t get quite as many nutrients as they needed from her."
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@debradownsouth - again unless you know the breeder there are always two sides to the situation. It is very, very rare that in Basenjis there are what would be called runts in 30+ years in the breed and as a breeder. They may be smaller when born, but I had one that was the smallest born in size/weight that turned out to be the biggest in the litter when mature. I have since this post was posted know the breeder. Keep in mind that this breeder had a contract and did take the pup back. I can honestly say that there are NO BYB, not responsible breeders that will do this. Say what you might and I do not hold anything against the people that returned the pup. The fact that this breeder took responsibility for this pup says volumes. Again, unless you really know the situation from both sides I believe this was the best outcome for this pup to be taken back to the breeder.
