Show in MD May 20th

[tanza]

@SweetShelby:

Well we spent the day at the park, enjoying the river and I actually had the opportunity to meet a purebred basenji in my new neighborhood. And her owner got to meet my 2. I realize dog shows are a business and it's not about the dogs. I would've gone to see the dogs and my dogs would have simply been with me, not interacting with the other dogs. But my dogs love to be with me in new situations and whether it's a dog show, horse show, farm show, or movie at the mall, it's new to them and they get to smell new things, hear new sounds and still be with me. I can't take them to the movie at the mall but one would figure a dog show is acceptable. I didn't mean to get all riled up about this. As for health, my dogs were just to the vet and pronounced in excellent health and "absolutely beautiful" by the vet. (granted he problably says this to a lot of proud humoms but I'll take the compliment ). Also because my pups are mixes, I don't have to worry about some of the genetic problems that the purebreds have problems with.

It's over now, anyway so I would be interested, if anyone took any pictures, if you could post them. I would love to see the basenjis in particular.

I totally disagree with your statement that dogs shows are a "business" and it is all about the dogs.. at least for all of us that are owner/handlers or breeder handlers… and they far out weigh the professional handlers. Owner and/or breeders that show do so because they enjoy it AND that they want to show that their Basenji (or any breed) is conformationally correct and of good temperament, and general health... and the conformation ring, or even the Obedience/Rally at shows are what that does. For me as a breeder it is a way to verify that I understand the Basenji Standard as I read it and that I am breeding a correct Basenji according to that standard.... and while I don't always win and every dog is not a show dog it is still a way of seeing and understanding the breed.

And I will add one more thing about mixes, you might think they "will" not get the genetic problems as purebreds, but to me that is totally an incorrect statement. You have the chance of getting "all" the genetic problems of "all" the breeds that are mixed... I am not sure why you would think that you don't have to worry about genetic problems... The ONLY reason that people know about the genetic problems in purebreds is because responsible breeders keep track of them, discuss them, look for cures for them, and make them public for people to learn about and understand.

[tanza]

And to be very honest, I have seen many mixes at outdoor shows… just visiting, of course again, they can't be sniffing or playing with the other dogs... and very rarely does anyone ever say anything.. as typically shows are on public grounds... indoor shows are a different story, as there is Much less room to move around...
Also as said there are matches and also all dogs are welcome to visit at lure trails, in fact at ours we have lots of mixes that come at the end of the day and let their dogs chase the lure.....
We (show and breeders) are NOT the "nasty stuck up people" we are many times made out to be... BUT we believe in purebred dogs and responsible breeding and that includes people that breed mixes (which are typically by accident) and puppy mills that breed for profit...

[Basenji_Boy]

@tanza:

We (show and breeders) are NOT the "nasty stuck up people" we are many times made out to be… BUT we believe in purebred dogs and responsible breeding and that includes people that breed mixes (which are typically by accident) and puppy mills that breed for profit...

IMO, What Tanza say's here is true from my limited experience with the show world.
The breeders are more than likely to answer questions and talk to the spectators, while the people that are in it professionally seem to not have the time for all of that and seem very focused on the task at hand…..winning!

Breeders want to educate, and share information and have fun showing dogs. It's not really win at all costs for them......IMO.

[tanza]

And believe me, there is NO money in showing… none!!!! But it certainly costs much!!!! And while we want to win.... it is about the dogs...

[JazzysMom]

And I will add one more thing about mixes, you might think they "will" not >>get the genetic problems as purebreds, but to me that is totally an >>incorrect statement. You have the chance of getting "all" the genetic >>>problems of "all" the breeds that are mixed…

LOL, I was just about to say the same thing. I think w/the mixes -- and like I said, my 2 B's are the first purebreds I've ever owned, and my beloved Gypsy is def. a mix -- you have a greater risk of health problems, and often the genetic risks are unknown because you are not sure exactly what the mix may be.

We (show and breeders) are NOT the "nasty stuck up people" we are >>many times made out to be...

I have to agree with that. I'm not a breeder, and not really a "show person", but the breeders/show people I've encountered over the last two years have been friendly, helpful, welcoming, and often have mutts of their own at home!
And they also tend to think their mutts are more beautiful than anyone else's.
The breeders/show people are also just regular "humoms and hudads".

[Basenji_Boy]

@tanza:

And believe me, there is NO money in showing… none!!!! But it certainly costs much!!!! And while we want to win.... it is about the dogs...

Yeah, I can show you lot's of $25.00 entry fee payments and a bunch of .50 cent ribbons for the trouble….....gas......food....your time.......Yep, there's no money in it.......none.

Jasper got Reserve Winner this weekend and we did get a rosettee........OK $1.50 for that.:D:D

[JazzysMom]

Yes it is a business and there are people there earning a living, doing what >>they do for a job and take it very seriously. Like it or not that's what it is.

Are there many breeders who do it to earn a living? Seems to be it's more of a hobby – for lack of a better word -- and a work of love for the ones that I've met. Most have other "real" jobs outside the dog show world.
I know there are professional handlers, but I've only seen a few. Seems to me most I've seen have been the owners and/or breeders who take them in to the ring.

[lvoss]

Just in defense of the show holding clubs. They require that only dogs entered in the show be on the grounds because of liability. The club holding the show has to have insurance for the event and if there is a incident it is the show holding club that the people are going to come after. People who have entered their dogs in the show have a signed agreement with the club, those that have not entered dogs do not. The clubs are simply protecting their ability to get insurance to be able to hold shows in the future.

[tanza]

@Basenji_Boy:

Yeah, I can show you lot's of $25.00 entry fee payments and a bunch of .50 cent ribbons for the trouble….....gas......food....your time.......Yep, there's no money in it.......none.

Jasper got Reserve Winner this weekend and we did get a rosettee........OK $1.50 for that.:D:D

Hey a rosette…. WOW, what a treat..
And for all of you that don't understand dog shows, you only get points to your conformation championship by winning.... reserve is like the best of the rest...gggg

[tanza]

@JazzysMom:

Yes it is a business and there are people there earning a living, doing what >>they do for a job and take it very seriously. Like it or not that's what it is.

Are there many breeders who do it to earn a living? Seems to be it's more of a hobby – for lack of a better word -- and a work of love for the ones that I've met. Most have other "real" jobs outside the dog show world.
I know there are professional handlers, but I've only seen a few. Seems to me most I've seen have been the owners and/or breeders who take them in to the ring.

I would say that over 80% it is a hobby…. only professional handlers make a living out of it... Most of us have "real jobs" to support our dogs.

[Basenji_Boy]

@tanza:

Hey a rosette…. WOW, what a treat..
And for all of you that don't understand dog shows, you only get points to your conformation championship by winning.... reserve is like the best of the rest...gggg

There where a lot of dogs entered, most I think I've seen at one show…...but yes.....best of the rest, a rosette.:( Not much return for the expense involved which is the point here. We've got lots of ribbons.:rolleyes:

[Basenji_Boy]

@JazzysMom:

Yes it is a business and there are people there earning a living, doing what >>they do for a job and take it very seriously. Like it or not that's what it is.

Are there many breeders who do it to earn a living? Seems to be it's more of a hobby – for lack of a better word -- and a work of love for the ones that I've met. Most have other "real" jobs outside the dog show world.
I know there are professional handlers, but I've only seen a few. Seems to me most I've seen have been the owners and/or breeders who take them in to the ring.

No, I'm referring to the professional handlers and I've seen lot's of them. We know some people who pay a professional handler to "special" a dog and it isn't chump change. There's some big money in the sport, those tractor trailers and big motorhomes you see in the parking lot's aren't always the weekend breeder and show/owner's vehicles. A lot of people showing dogs have people backing them, so there is more to it that the casual weekender.

[jys1011]

Well just to recap…the show was a lot of FUN!! The Carroll County Ag Center is really pretty & scenic IMO (I'm a city girl so what do I know ha!) The weather was glorious & the sun in all its splendor made for a wonderful picnic lunch after the basenjis showed And boy were there a whole lotta basenjis!!! Got to meet some special breeders & some smart show people including Mrs. BBoy!!

The Basenji Park kids did good job IMO...even if their prize was worth $.50 every penny was earned & well deserved.

[tanza]

Still the majority of people that show are owners and breeders, not professionals… that do this for a living... or if they do, it is not their full time jobs unless they are the "big" time handlers....

[Basenji_Boy]

@tanza:

Still the majority of people that show are owners and breeders, not professionals… that do this for a living... or if they do, it is not their full time jobs unless they are the "big" time handlers....

That's true. My point is the "big time" handlers are the one's that don't seem to want to be bothered and can appear snooty….they do to me.

For me, If it was just the breeder/owner's out there, I'd probably go to more shows.

[tanza]

I hear you Basenji Boy… but at least in the Basenji ring there are not near as many big time handlers as there are in other breeds, in fact very few... many of them that are handlers for Basenjis, are breeders themselves...... Most of them don't want to do Basenjis...gggg

[Basenji_Boy]

@tanza:

Most of them don't want to do Basenjis…gggg

Ha Ha Ha! I believe that. Give me the people that have some compasion for the dog itself…....from what I see, Basenji people are some of the best at that.:)

[JazzysMom]

I understand that, but I guess… I see the professionals as being in the minority, at least from my own --- very limited ---- observations.

Your post made it sound like most people involved are in it for, and making big, money. And I just haven't seen that at all. . . a few in it for money, but not most.
But my uneducated guess would be that those who pay the big bucks to handlers did NOT MAKE their big bucks by showing or breeding dogs.

[Quercus]

<_>

Pat, I think the confusion started because I stated that *AKC is a registery and a business. And SweetShelby then said dog showing is a business…which I also disagree with. It can be a hobby, or a passion, and for very few an occupation...but for most the actual act of showing dogs has NOTHING to do with making money...in fact, it has a lot to do with losing money (as I think Basenji Boy mentioned)...and perhaps for some...a tax shelter

I think it might be hard for people who are completely unfamiliar with the conformation world to understand *what and *how AKC operates. And how all-breed and show giving clubs operate within it...and how breeders operate within that...

A dog show is absolutely all about the dogs...there is NOTHING else going on there if isn't about the dogs...almost to the point of ridiculousness. What it isn't about is pets, I guess. A lot of the dogs at shows ARE pets living comfortably in someone's home. And a lot of them are or will be parents to puppies that will live a pampered life of Reilly. But the show itself is not really about pet dogs...it is (supposed) to be about breeding stock._

[Basenji_Boy]

Your post made it sound like most people involved are in it for, and making big, money. And I just haven't seen that at all. . . a few in it for money, but not most.

I wrote

Yes it is a business and there are people there earning a living, doing what they do for a job and take it very seriously. Like it or not that's what it is.

I didn't say "Most", just that there are some out there that earn a living doing it.

But my uneducated guess would be that those who pay the big bucks to handlers did NOT MAKE their big bucks by showing or breeding dogs

I wote

There's some big money in the sport, those tractor trailers and big motorhomes you see in the parking lot's aren't always the weekend breeder and show/owner's vehicles. A lot of people showing dogs have people backing them, so there is more to it that the casual weekender

.

That's correct, having a backer could mean that they do anything for a living or nothing at all and are just rich!