Coat Color Inheritance in basenji

Monika · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 17:35

is the page
http://www.pedigrees.zandebasenjis.com/
you can enter your name basenji?

Monika · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 17:37

Ok Avongara (Narla) of Brushy Run

Monika · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 17:38

Horsley and the line?

Monika · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 17:43

Candu's Rocket Man ???

lvoss · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 17:54

Specific dogs, not the lines, are:

Candu N Akuaba Hide and Seek

SunDiata's TwentyOne Gold

Avongara Black Opal of Brushy Run

Avongara Lexi of Brushy Run

Avongara Pepe of Brushy Run

Some lines have produced barred tris and are related to the above dogs but do not have any recessive blacks at this time.

FoPaws and HiCotn come to mind. Both have dogs going back to Ponedog's Serendipity

Monika · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 18:31

Khajah's Black Fula Challenge ???

Monika · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 18:33

thank you thank you

lvoss · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 18:38

Khajah Black Fula Challenge was a recessive black.

Patty · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 20:17

There is quite a difference here in the UK - the basenjis I've looked at in the links seem to have black ancestors as well. I can't recall having had a Fula Black in that case, in this country. We do have the Fula Tris who only have red/whites and tris in their ancestry. Fula,imported from the Sudan in 1959 by Veronica Tudor Williamns is thought to have carried this recessive gene. Fula Tris crop up very rarely - one breeder I know is devoted to the Fula Tris and has attempted over many years to find a sure way to breed them but it really seems to be a matter of luck. Incidentally, the Antefaas have bred 1 Fula Tri in 68 years!

lvoss · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 20:22

To have a Dominant Black the dog MUST have a black parent. Recessive blacks are born to two non-black parents.

My breeding this fall may produce both Dominant and Recessive blacks since my dominant black girl is an Avongara Rease of Brushy Run granddaughter and the sire is a great grandson of Ponedog's Serendipity and a producer of barred tris.

Patty · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 21:02

There have only ever been a very few breeders of black/whites in this country as you know. Jayne Stringer having been one. When the black/whites were introduced there were many breeders, here who wouldn't accept them. So I suppose that is why we haven't had Fula Blacks (as far as I know) although some breeders also called (and do still) the Fula Tris, 'Fula Blacks'

Looking at the photos of the Fula Black, I wouldn't think that many could tell the difference from a Fula Tri except by study of the pedigree. What's your opinion please, Ivoss?

Can anyone, please, let me have any links to photos of more Fula Blacks.

lvoss · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 21:28

I am not sure how you are using your terminology.

In the US, "Fula Tris" are what are also called "barred tris" because they have a bar of black that run across the tan of their cheeks.

You can see an example on this site, http://www.coho.net/~tattooed/meeka.htm

and also on this one if you scroll down to Deano,
http://www.hicotn.com/domestic.html

"Fula Blacks" are a bit more complicated because they seem to range from pipless tris to what appear to be true recessive blacks with no tan in the coat whatsoever.

Avongara Black Opal of Brushy Run is a very good example of one with no tan bleeding, http://www.basenji.org/african/OpalBR.htm

SunDiata's TwentyOne Gold is more of a pipless tri
From the front, http://www.npgcable.com/~basenji/Gallery/pedigrees/images/TwentyOneGold.jpg

From the rear, http://www.npgcable.com/~basenji/Gallery/pedigrees/images/TwentyOneGold2.jpg

Patty · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 21:58

We call the Barred Tris simply that - Barred Tris. It seems we have a terminology difference. Here the Fula tri is a recessive (first occurring seemingly after the introduction of Fula to this couintry, hence the name). They are often very black at birth but later on examination have red hairs mainly round the breech and on the inside of the back legs. They have no melon pips. The only one I've bred had, in adulthood, almost a red undercoat in the summer. Others I've seen in adulthood develop a 'muddy' colour coat. The term here has been confused with Fula black which until now I've not understood. Elspeth Ford (Taysenji) introduced the term Fula Black which I assume was from the US but the early breeders and especially Veronica who I believe, invented the term Fula Tri. were very put out about it and insisted that it was incorrect. Do you use this term even where no black/white Basenjis are in the pedigree? Thank you for the links I'll open them now, I've not seen many barred tris.

Thank you, you've cleared up a misunderstanding.

lvoss · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 22:04

A "Fula Black" does not have black and whites in its pedigree except other "Fula Blacks". It is a term used, at least in the US, to describe recessive blacks which are genetically distinct from Dominant Blacks.

The vast majority of black and white basenjis are dominant blacks, requiring one black parent to get the color. These dogs are NOT "fula blacks".

Patty · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 22:18

I've just got confused again. It seems that we're both talking about the same colouring but by different names. I was just assuming that there might also be a Fula Black and a Fula Tri, my apologies.

Thank you, Ivoss

I'm afraid I tend to be very traditional and as Veronica was my first mentor I haven't moved on a lot since her imparted knowledge. I pay tribute to these early breeders as without them we might never have had our lovely dogs

Thank you for the links, they're very enlightening. Have you ever come across a Fula Black withiout the red breech?

This is what I enjoy about this forum there's always things to learn from others.

lvoss · wrote on 6 Apr 2010, 22:22

Yes, Avongara Black Opal of Brushy Run and Avongara Pepe of Brushy Run are Fula Blacks without the red breech.

saba · wrote on 7 Apr 2010, 07:42

Sorry completely OT :o…

Ive had the pleasure of seeing Avongara Black Opal of Brushy Run, at the Victorian Specialty, Australia, in Jan 2010... I didnt know there were any Avongara's down here at all, so I think I nearly did a doubletake when I spotted her. I was absolutely speechless. Raced over to the catalogue, to confirm what, or I should say, who she was... Yep, it was an Avongara. I couldnt take my eyes off her... A very different bitch to anything I have seen at all. She had a rock solid temperament too. Very calm, and very snuggly with her owner :).

lvoss · wrote on 7 Apr 2010, 14:59

Opal is my Sophie's Aunt. She is a half sister of Sophie's sire, Avongara Cole of Brushy Run.

Monika · wrote on 7 Apr 2010, 15:10

Hi to everyone.
I've read all your posts and I'm going to answear. I'm not sure if I
understan everything, but let me try.

I breed a basenji female, Malmsey In Red Asiaczek. Father Abotere
Adunbi (brindle white), Mother Jelly Joshreen Asiaczek (red&white).
Malmsey has two brothers coloured trindle (I think you call it black
and white striped on the tan), Fula Tri. FCL does't accept this
colour.

In 2002 in KANIBARU Australia breeding was born Fula Black female,
after red&white parents.
http://www.kanibaru.com/2002pups.html

We call Fula black all unussual types with black colour.

I've found such a key to coated (the gene combinations that give the
following phenotypes):
D - not dilute d- dilute
Y - Red y - tri
K - Black K^br - brindle k - neither black nor brindle
Red and White - DDkkYY, DDkkYy, DdkkYY, DdkkYy
Black and White - DDKkYY, DDKkYy, DDKkyy, DDKKYY, DDKKYy, DDKKyy,
DdKkYY, DdKkYy, DdKkyy, DdKKYY, DdKKYy, DdKKyy, DDKK^brYY, DDKK^brYy,
DDKK^bryy, DdKK^brYY, DdKK^brYy, DdKK^bryy
Brindle and White - DDK^brkYY, DDK^brkYy, DDK^brK^brYY, DDK^brK^brYy,
DdK^brkYY, DdK^brkYy, DdK^brK^brYY, DdK^brK^brYy
Tri-color - DDkkyy, Ddkkyy
Trindle - DdK^brK^bryy, DdK^brkyy, DDK^brK^bryy, DDK^brkyy
Blue and White - ddKkYY, ddKkYy, ddKkyy, ddKKYY, ddKKYy,
ddKKyy,ddKK^brYY, ddKK^brYy, ddKK^bryy
Blue Fawn and White - ddkkYY, ddkkYy
Blue Tri - ddkkyy
Blue Brindle and White - ddK^brkYY, ddK^brkYy, ddK^brK^brYY, ddK^brK^brYy