No, I have not talked to the breeder. That is a good suggestion and I will do that right away.
Thanks
Sick Dog Question– help, please?!
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Chuck Eisenmann used to swear by feeding his GSDs on newspaper. He felt it wasn't good to feed in a bowl because it was difficult for the dog to avoid ending up with food all over his nose. Esthetics, perhaps, but maybe Spencer feels the same way, or associates the bowl with the pain he was experiencing…..
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If anybody's still interested, I thought I would update you on the gastronomic delights and culinary adventures here at Chez Spencer. The little scamp feels sooo much better (for which I am very grateful), but he is still only interested in yummy food balls, of a kind deemed acceptable to his newly refined palate. And he still wants them on a plate, not in a bowl, which I'm OK with. I elevate it, and that seems to make him happier. I'm feeding him smaller portions four times a day, and he usually eats most of it. Unless it's chicken. Or has softened kibble mixed in. He's wise to that.
I realize that it's probably time for a little tough love, since my dog has healed and is now training me. But he's only gained back six ounces in two weeks, and he lost six pounds. That's a lot less a lot slower than we had hoped, so I fix whatever I think he'll eat and continue to shape it into little balls. I have developed two kinds: a casserole ball (with meat, rice and pasta or rice) and a sandwich ball (with meat, bread and cheese). Sometimes, there's gravy; sometimes not. So far, he hasn't requested a china plate or his water in a goblet.
This is just so odd. My vet, who recommended the food ball trick when Spencer's mouth was sore, has never heard of a dog refusing to accept food any other way once the mouth healed. Do I just have a prima dogga?
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My 14 year old girl used to eat dry kibble (plus the occasional human food) till she had pancreatitis 6 months ago, and I had to 'special feed' her for awhile. Now "the Princess" will only eat what she likes, various kibble (I have 4 different bags open) soaked in chicken broth, with lots of chicken or turkey or other meat on top of it to get her fired up. She is NOT too thin so if she misses a meal it's OK, but I still baby her and according to my husband, I have completely RUINED her! So, I feel your pain! I like "Prima Dogga", I sure have one too!
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Yes, Prince Spence and your Princess (this is Nicky, right?) definitely have us wrapped around their little curly tails! I know he's manipulating me, but I just don't feel I can do much about it. He has to eat– he is nothing but bones. I know this bothers me more than it bothers him (seemingly, no big deal from his POV), but I feel compelled to give in to his demands so he will eat. At 14, they have the upper paw and they know it!
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If anybody's still interested, I thought I would update you on the gastronomic delights and culinary adventures here at Chez Spencer. The little scamp feels sooo much better (for which I am very grateful), but he is still only interested in yummy food balls, of a kind deemed acceptable to his newly refined palate. And he still wants them on a plate, not in a bowl, which I'm OK with. I elevate it, and that seems to make him happier. I'm feeding him smaller portions four times a day, and he usually eats most of it. Unless it's chicken. Or has softened kibble mixed in. He's wise to that.
I realize that it's probably time for a little tough love, since my dog has healed and is now training me. But he's only gained back six ounces in two weeks, and he lost six pounds. That's a lot less a lot slower than we had hoped, so I fix whatever I think he'll eat and continue to shape it into little balls. I have developed two kinds: a casserole ball (with meat, rice and pasta or rice) and a sandwich ball (with meat, bread and cheese). Sometimes, there's gravy; sometimes not. So far, he hasn't requested a china plate or his water in a goblet.
This is just so odd. My vet, who recommended the food ball trick when Spencer's mouth was sore, has never heard of a dog refusing to accept food any other way once the mouth healed. Do I just have a prima dogga?
When they get old and have other health issues (for your boy that would be Fanconi), I don't think I would go the "tough love" route. If you can deal with the special feeding, I say keep on doing what is working.
If he were a young dog and healthly… then I would vote for tough love, big time.
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I am so happy to spoil my Diggie-dog. I say "He's my dog and I'll spoil him if I want to."
Have you tried increasing Spencer's exercise? That may help increase his appetite. Digital goes swimming on Thurs and his appetite spikes on that day.
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When they get old and have other health issues (for your boy that would be Fanconi), I don't think I would go the "tough love" route. If you can deal with the special feeding, I say keep on doing what is working.
If he were a young dog and healthly… then I would vote for tough love, big time.
That's what I've been thinking, too. He needs food, as much as I can get down him right now. Taking the bowl up and making him eat on my terms just seems counterproductive. He's 14 and has beaten Fanconi for 8 years, so why not indulge him? Of course, he's been spoiled for quite some time.
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I am so happy to spoil my Diggie-dog. I say "He's my dog and I'll spoil him if I want to."
Have you tried increasing Spencer's exercise? That may help increase his appetite. Digital goes swimming on Thurs and his appetite spikes on that day.
I've been in the "spoil 'em while we have 'em" camp for a while, too!
Spencer hasn't been getting much exercise, so I wondered about that. He has been so weak, and his thin little legs tremble when he stands. And he's been shivering, since he's lost almost all of his body fat. It's been chilly and rainy here, so I've kept him inside with a sweater on his heated dog bed. Now that he's starting to get his strength back, I'm thinking I might give him a slow walk up the street and back on the next nice day. Of course, I'll probably bundle us both up like Eskimos!
You must be used to the cold in Colorado. Spencer and I are from SoCal, so the mountains feel much colder to me (and probably him) than they really are!
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I would humour him with whatever he wants until he gains his weight back. That will be time enough to stop spoiling him…...if you have the heart to do it. With a 14 year old, I think I could live with letting him have what he wants. I have spent the last year spending an inordinate amount of time and money on a soon to be 26 year old mare who gives me far less pleasure than my Basenji does, so I guess I am just a pushover in any case.
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I don't know that me or the basenjis are more used to the cold, but we deal with it. Of course Digital's favorite game is fence running/fighting and with about 300 ft of shared fencing with the neighbor's dogs, they do that. I actually started the therapy swims because Digital was loosing muscle mass in his thighs and this is our holistic vet recommended. And it is so helpful in the winter.
We also wear coats (fetchdog.com is having a wonderful sale right now as I posted in another thread) - somedays inside and out. And I have heated warm things for the boyz. I would NOT do strenuous exercises with S, just a little something to get the joints/digestive systems moving. You can always do a little more the next time.
And, of course with Digital, if something happened to me, hubby would spoil him and if something happened to us both, he'd go back to Mary Turner, his breeder, who would spoil him more than we do, so he's pretty much set.
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I don't know if I suggested this, been a rough few weeks– but can you ask your vet if your dog can have cyproheptadine. It is a miracle drug, basically just an antihistamine that has and incredible effect on appetite. At about $15 to 20 for a 100 pill bottle, I'd buy stock and be their spokesperson if they wanted me.
I learned about it when Sayblee reached the can almost see her hip bones stage due to her utter lack of interest in food, any food, and all the massive blood work and testing found nothing. She simply would eat only enough to not die. I was actually putting mushy food in her mouth and massaging her throat to get her to eat in order to try to get weight back on her. My friend with a research vet suggested it, my vet ordered it, miracle. I have used it over the years with dogs with cancer, Sayblee a few years later during chemo continued to eat thanks I am sure to it, and dogs on medications that required eating when they didn't want food.
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http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Rx_Info_Sheets/rx_cyproheptadine.pdf
http://petsmd.com/RX/Cats-And-Dogs/Cyproheptadine
It is mostly recommended to try and increase appetitie in cats.
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I learned about it when Sayblee reached the can almost see her hip bones stage due to her utter lack of interest in food, any food, and all the massive blood work and testing found nothing. She simply would eat only enough to not die. I was actually putting mushy food in her mouth and massaging her throat to get her to eat in order to try to get weight back on her. My friend with a research vet suggested it, my vet ordered it, miracle. I have used it over the years with dogs with cancer, Sayblee a few years later during chemo continued to eat thanks I am sure to it, and dogs on medications that required eating when they didn't want food.
That is amazing, Debra! Of course, I'll check into it right away. That is exactly what I did with Spencer for two weeks– put the food in his mouth and massaged his throad to get him to swallow. Because he takes 14 pills a day, I still have to do this with the meds. He's eating now, but he's very, very picky. The least little thing not to his liking will cause him to run away from the food. I can't hide vitamins or Omega-3s in his food anymore, or he won't eat. If he likes what I offer, and I roll it into balls, he'll eat most of it; otherwise, forget it-- not interested. His mouth is healed; the battery of tests show nothing, yet he doesn't want to eat. So, thank you! And thank you, Pat, for the links!
Pamela and Spencer
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We also wear coats (fetchdog.com is having a wonderful sale right now as I posted in another thread) - somedays inside and out. And I have heated warm things for the boyz. I would NOT do strenuous exercises with S, just a little something to get the joints/digestive systems moving. You can always do a little more the next time.
And, of course with Digital, if something happened to me, hubby would spoil him and if something happened to us both, he'd go back to Mary Turner, his breeder, who would spoil him more than we do, so he's pretty much set.
Diggie is a lucky B– being spoiled in the manner to which he is entitled!
And, wow, what a buy on those coats! Even though winter is almost over, I think I'll buy one. Spencer is so thin, he'll probably need it for a few more months, since there are many chilly days in spring. I think we'll take a short walk today-- even if it's just up the street and back. Maybe that will perk him up a bit.
And you guessed it, eeeefarm, I will not have the heart to stop spoiling Spencer. He has me just where he wants me-- at his beck and call, like any well-trained Basenji human.
Pamela and Spencer
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http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Rx_Info_Sheets/rx_cyproheptadine.pdf
http://petsmd.com/RX/Cats-And-Dogs/Cyproheptadine
It is mostly recommended to try and increase appetitie in cats.
The research was done on cats. As I am sure I posted here before, in a study on cats undergoing chemo, they found that those cats who were on cyproheptadine continued to eat. It has been used with dogs for at 8 to 10 yrs. Please note your 2nd link did not separate dog or cat for appetite. It works amazing for both. Because the research was done with cats, that is most of the citings. My vet in PA who uses it recommended it because she said it is far safer overall than other appetite medications. Of course there are dogs, and some cats, that don't respond. But when a dog truly needs to eat, it's worth asking your vet, don't you think?
It's funny– I can't win for losing. If I post something and post links/research to back it up, I get slammed. If I don't, then I get posts indicating I don't know what I am posting. I think it's easier to just post the darned links to begin with and avoid a do-over.
Cyproheptadine: What You Need to Know as a Pet Owner - Paw ...
www.pawnation.com/pet-health/cyproheptadine-for-pets/
Apr 12, 2011 ? Cyproheptadine is a veterinary drug used to stimulate appetite in cats, and may also work in dogs.What To Do When Your Dog or Cat Won?t Eat
Anorexia In Pets
Ron Hines DVM PhD
http://www.2ndchance.info/anorexia.htm
A relatively mild antihistamine, cyproheptadine (Periactin), has been found to stimulate appetite in many pets.The drug, btw, works in humans also– so shouldn't be a surprise that while cats may have highest response, dogs often do also:
Cyproheptadine is widely used in treating children?s and adolescents?
migraines, nightmares, allergic reactions, mild and uncomplicated
hives, serotonin syndrome, carcinoid, drug-induced hyperhydrosis and
anorexia nervosa. It is a powerful and very reliable appetite stimulant.
However, only some people (among even those who take Periactin
regularly) know that Cyproheptadine can be used to ease chronic renal
failures in cats and dogs.An effective appetite stimulant medication can become a life-savior
drug for your pet.
Full article: Cyproheptadine for cats | Trusted.MD Network http://trusted.md/blog/dochan/2011/03/22/cyproheptadine_for_cats#ixzz1loCWqalBHeck, it even works in Bunnies.
http://www.bio.miami.edu/hare/ileus.html\
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Diggie is a lucky B– being spoiled in the manner to which he is entitled!
Pamela and SpencerI couldn't even respond before because the love made me tearful, so let me just "LIKE" your post. All the poor dogs left outside to freeze, it's good to remember people like you who do so much.
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Thank you, Debra! Like so many Bs on here, Spencer is a well-loved, pampered little guy. He is the baby– and the boss-- in this household.
That's so interesting about the cyproheptadine being used to ease chronic renal failure. If it's good for their appetite and their kidneys, too, that's twice as beneficial for Spencer! I'm going to ask my vet about it when I take Spencer in to be weighed on Friday. I'm hoping he's gained a few ounces. Today was his last day on antibiotics, so hopefully, that will have a positive impact on his appetite. I appreciate your taking the time to post the info on cyproheptadine. I had never heard of it, and it does seem to be a miracle drug!
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I had never heard of it at the time. And my vet, like many, only knew it worked with cats. But my research vet in PA and her assistant (my co breeder) always are on top of things, lol. I was crying about how horrible Sayblee looked, how sad I was to have to force feed her and Brenda said "have you TRIED cyproheptadine."
Hope that your boy starts turning around soon. It is so hard when they are sick.
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I thought I would post an update on Spencer's progress to let all of his friends know that he is doing SO much better! He has not only regained most of his appetite, he has relaxed his standards to accommodate non-balled, non-creative food. Sometimes. When he's feeling generous. Or hungry. This is not to say that he is no longer picky. He would prefer his food rolled into bite-size balls but, as a semi-acceptable alternative, he will take the dish du jour separated into neat spoonfuls on a plate. No bowl. Bowls are no longer acceptable in our house, except for water.
He will now eat with relish and drink with abandon, but he is not gaining the weight back as quickly as I had hoped. Being thin doesn't bother him nearly as much as it bothers me. He has most of his energy back, and he has regained his curiosity. I think he is out of the woods. He is one tough little guy. This is the third time a vet has told us that he probably wouldn't make it… and all three times, he has bounced back. He amazes me, and as long as he tells me that he wants to go on, I'm going to do all I can to make sure he has the best chance of doing exactly that. These are incredible little dogs!
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Happy, happy news! He is a fighter and so are you, you make a great pair. Hooray!
