Red and white byb girl sale 250.00 houston

[westcoastflea1]

http://houston.ebayclassifieds.com/dogs-puppies/houston/basenji-female-dog-for-sale/?ad=8514150

ive emailed brat about this girl
the 250.00 is i believe more then brat will spend
i believe she will be sold unspayed which puts her in danger of being purchased as a breeder by another byb or puppymill

if the seller is willing to do go down to $200.00 and brat will spend about 100.00 for her is it possible for people on this forum to donate the additional 100.00 or so to enable this girl to be purchased and placed into the brat system?

[lvoss]

There is a reason BRAT won't pay for dogs from breeders. Putting money in their pocket only encourages them to keep doing this. She has whelped a litter and the owner could very well be keeping a puppy to breed from that litter and just getting rid of her because they don't see her as valuable. Rescue paying for this dog will only reward the behavior and encourage them to seek to do it again when they are done with their next one.

[DebraDownSouth]

Exactly. It's called voting with your dollars. If the seller drops the price to a point that she loses money, it's fine. But rescue doesn't buy dogs. Maybe you can write her and explain the need to spay, find cheap one close, etc.?

[westcoastflea1]

and at the same time rescue is about helping dogs in need lets not forgot that part of it shall we?

[lvoss]

But enabling irresponsible breeders to continue to breed means doing harm to many dogs while trying to help one.

[westcoastflea1]

below is the first email sent to me by the woman who is selling these dogs

Long story. I went and picked up my female basenji whom was staying with a breeder in KY. While I was there I realized the conditions were not what I was told and basically seeing them I bought the rest of her dogs to get them out of there. On my way home from KY (and trust me my husband thinks I'm crazy). I visited with my father in east Texas and was told of another breeder whose husband was ill and desperately needed to sell her male. By this time I figured whats one more? Well one more turned into 20. Since I cant keep everyone and my homeowners association has informed me that I am only allowed 3 pets per household. So I have to find everybody homes.
-Mary Beth

below is the second email in response to whether she will be still be breeding

Yes I am selling my male as well. He is an excellent breeder and a real sweet heart. I grown very attached to 2 puppies and want to keep them. So with the homeowners association tell me to get rid of the extra pets I cant keep him and the pups. No I dont plan on breeding again. No I had not planned on spaying her, I bought her from a CKC Basenji breeder in the Spring area. First I thought it 2 be 2 soon after puppies and want her new owner to have that option. She was a very good Mother.
-Mary Beth

i dont see how taking this female from this woman is going to do anything but good for everyone involved especially the female basenji which again is what i thought rescue was all about??

i suppose if you you would like to hide behind the theory of "enabling irresponsible breeders" etc etc etc rather than actually looking at this particular situation and do something about it thats your option

however i was hoping that if i posted here some of the members on this forum would see this as a situation where they could help a female basenji who has been used for breeding and will most certainly continue to be used for breeding unless she is taken into the brat system but i guess i was wrong

[Basenjimamma]

http://houston.ebayclassifieds.com/dogs-puppies/houston/akc-basenji-puppies/?ad=8514343

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4ADBF_enUS314US315&q=basenji+17000+el+camino+real%2c+Houston%2c

This is why enabling breeders like this one…things won't change..If she cared about her beloved Ann..she would have her spayed before adopting her out...Ann is just a dollar sign in this lady's mind..as well as the puppies and the male listed (but sold or removed)...just my opinion.
I am on the fence about helping these dogs ( meaning dogs from breeders like this, not these in particular..) out..yes the dogs deserve better but if money exchanges hands the "breeder" succeeded...Next year another litter will be bred, because it worked this year..even if they make just a few dollars..it isn't like they spend any money on the litter as far as health testing or what have you...

When I have helped BRAT out we have always gotten the dogs given to us...very rarely to never does BRAT pay for dogs to be taken in..it just doesn't work out financially or humanly, as fosters are few and far apart..
If she is willing to let Ann or any of her other dogs go for "free", BRAT would more than likely be right there helping out..

Sorry to upset, this is just my opinion.

[tanza]

I agree with you Basenjimamma…. And interesting that she has these pups listed as AKC when the Bitch is NOT AKC registered... but CKC (PuppyMill, not Canada)

[DebraDownSouth]

@westcoastflea1:

_Yes I am selling my male as well. He is an excellent breeder and a real sweet heart.

First I thought it 2 be 2 soon after puppies and want her new owner to have that option. She was a very good Mother.
-Mary Beth_

i dont see how taking this female from this woman is going to do anything but good for everyone involved especially the female basenji which again is what i thought rescue was all about??

i suppose if you you would like to hide behind the theory of "enabling irresponsible breeders" etc etc etc rather than actually looking at this particular situation and do something about it thats your option

Okay let me try to explain because it is obvious by your snarky "hide behind" that you are upset.

This woman is CLUELESS. She will keep doing this over and over unless she has great difficulty selling and getting her money back. That she says he's a great breeder and she wants whoever buys the bitches to have the option to keep producing dogs makes it obvious that the ONLY help we can give her is education.

It is enabling. You buy her dogs, she buys more to spread more misery. You refuse to buy, you work on trying to educate her, you MIGHT break the cycle. It isn't hiding behind, it is refusing to pat ourselves on the back for saving one dog while helping the woman get money to keep doing it. It is refusing to look at one issue instead of the whole picture. It is NOT hiding behind a moment of "feel good" when it potentially creates more problems.

[crystalncody]

I don't know this woman, and I'm not saying the same is true for her, but when I got Cody, nearly everything his previous owner told me was a lie. She sounded so sincere through emails and over the phone, but in reality, she was just trying to get rid of some dogs, make a few bucks, and probably expand her little operation with a breed from which she could get puppies more than once a year (she was already breeding Italian greyhounds, chihuahuas, and one other breed). I got Cody for free, but she still felt the need to lie to me.

This woman could be perfectly nice and completely on the up and up, but she could also just be telling you what she thinks you want to hear.

[westcoastflea1]

i can only assume no one bothered to read her emails

she is allowed only 3 dogs per her homeowners association agreement

she is keeping 2 puppies and the female that belonged to her daughter

she has stated very clearly she is NOT going to be breeding and will not be having any more litters

she is taking a loss on this particular female she is selling

she has no reason to lie to me since i simply emailed her asking about purchasing the female

if we can line the pockets of large puppymill operations who SAY they are going out of business then i think we can give a woman 200.00 who SAYS she will no longer be breeding and still feel that we have not fallen from our moral high ground

and yes she is clueless which is why its important that the people who do know more then she does try to clue her in in a friendly non-judgmental, nonthreatening way

to many many people breeding a dog to make some money is nothing out of the ordinary, they dont know about fanconi, they dont know about puppymills which is why education rather then anger and condescension are the only way that things will change one owner and one dog at a time

which is why i have been friendly and polite when answering her questions about fanconi, rather then lecturing her about what it is that she is doing of course it might make me feel better to stand on my soapbox and spout off about what a terrible person she is so that i can feel self righteous but really whats the point in that?

iam FULLY aware of brats policies and of the lack of foster homes

im FULLY aware of the fact that buying from puppymills petstores and bybs who continue to breed only perpetuates the cycle

i do not believe that in this particular instance that is what is happening which is why im going out on a limb to try to help this girl
if some would like to see this act as something that is being done to warrant "a pat on the back" well thats your own twisted way of viewing things im sorry for you

if i needed a pat on the back that much i could simply look at my current foster and pat myself on the back every time i did so
why go to such lengths for something so trivial???

while i appreciate all the rhetoric about "perpetuating the cycle" etc etc im already fully informed so need to waste any more time on it thank you anyway

if i felt that any of it was pertinent to this case i would never have posted about this girl

i posted because i was fairly certain that there were at least a few caring people who would realize that purchasing this girl to enter the brat system would not be "perpetuating the cycle of misery" blah blah blah but that instead it would be a real chance to donate 5.00 or 10.00 each to ensure that this girl could enter the brat system
be spayed and find a loving home

but i can see i should have known better

shame on me for thinking it was possible

[westcoastflea1]

there are always doubts in every single situation you encounter
is that a reason for not acting?

[DebraDownSouth]

Your anger is apparent. That others can't disagree without you attacking them is not what I am used to from you. That you have to attack when others feel as strongly that it IS enabling makes me wonder why you are so angry. This person didn't buy one dog, she got 20. So she lost money on this one (she CLAIMS)…she made money. Talk her into giving up the bitch for free, talk her into neutering the male. Then I might believe she isn't lying and doing it to make money.

Regardless, it is one thing to disagree, another to attack others for disagreeing. Basically you are beating up others for having an idea of what is right because it doesn't agree with your view.

And yes, if you have a SERIOUS doubt and the action goes against your experience and beliefs, it is a reason not to act. Not one person here suggested they never act if ANY doubt!!!

[westcoastflea1]

you are entitled to your opinion and if posting this has enabled you to vent some of your anger and frustration im happy i was able to help

it is quite obvious at this point that nothing further will come from this but more negative postings about what might or might not be

i have this womans name
the town she lives in and the law governing the number of dogs allowed per houshold in her town

it is absolutely possible to check this woman out and view her home and get as much info as possible before deciding to purchase the basenji
but rather then people trying to come up with constructive ideas about what to do all anyone seems to want to do is talk about how it SHOULDNT be done because this MIGHT happen or that MIGHT happen
or this MIGHT be a lie etc etc etc

and the sky MIGHT fall tomorrow too but that doesnt mean you just sit and do nothing does it?

am i frustrated by the absolutely meaningless dialogue that has taken place so far ?? absolutely

why???
because if you are not here to help and hopefully come up with some constructive ways of dealing with the issue at hand then why are you posting ??

[lvoss]

The constructive idea is to encourage her to give the dog to BRAT.

Educate her about why that is the best option for her and her dog that she says she loves so much.

[westcoastflea1]

lets live in the real world here for just a minute can we please??

a person can say they love their dog, doesnt mean they do OR that they will do what is best for the dog

kind of goes without saying doesnt it?

i think we can all agree to agree that we all loathe people who dont love their dogs and we can all feel superior because we are better then them
good now that that is out of the way

the GOAL is to get this dog into brats system
what is the best way to do accomplish this ?
what has the best chance of working ?
encourage the seller to GIVE the dog away and educate her as to why this is the best idea?

or pay her the 200.00 and consider it money well spent and then take the dog and let brat find her a home

and once again this is IF it can be shown that by doing so we are not "perpetuating the cycle of …....."

which of course is also a given and should have been seen as given right from the start
so once again (deep breath))

ANY constructive ideas on how to check out the situation in texas ??

all it would take is someone to go to her house check out the situation make sure its not a breeding facility sound her out and then make an informed decision about whether purchasing the dog will perpetuate....... or not
anything else is just a lot of hot air and a waste of time

[Basenjimamma]

I live in houston…and the adress on her ad..is an office building...

Sent from my rockin' Samsung Vibrate via Tapatalk.

[westcoastflea1]

thanks
she has another ad on another site and it is saying clear lake

perhaps the houston address is business and home is in clear lake?

perhaps look up in the directory an address for mary beth weiss? to get the home address?
of course if anyone can simply email her ask for a time to meet and see the dog she would i assume give the home address which would be great would be one good way of finding out what is going on

[lvoss]

If we want to live in the real world then you would admit that if she can be lying about loving the dog then she could just as easily be lying about not having plans to breed one or both of the puppies she kept from this litter.

The constructive answer that does not put money into the pockets of an irresponsible breeder is to do the best you can to educate about why surrrendering the dog to a reputable rescue is in the best interest of her and the dog. It may not be successful but it is the best anyone can do. I don't see you volunteering to shell out the money to do this, instead you came here to ask other people to spend their hard earned money to do it and have tried to lay a guilt trip on those that said they don't feel it is right reward irresponsibility. It isn't like she didn't know the dog limits when she bred the bitch or decided to keep 2 puppies and dump their now no longer wanted dam.

[westcoastflea1]

as far as im concerned shes an ignorant person who is making a buck selling dogs
so what?
who cares?
she is not the reason for this post

what is pertinent is discovering whether she intends to keep breeding or not
if not then get the dog away from her
end of story
will we ever know 100% if it was the right decision ??
no we wont
but id rather err on the side of helping the dog then sit back and do nothing because we cant be 100% certain that she wont breed again
if you find fault with that so be it