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Possible seizures????

Basenji Health Issues & Questions
  • M

    Hi all:

    Just joined. We rescued Moki, our basenji, back in 2001. He is 10-11 now. Over the past several months, he has exhibited a very odd behavior. All of a sudden, he will start fidgeting, then he frantically licks his front legs, while what can only be called screaming. This lasts about 30-45 seconds and seems to come in groups. Are these seizures? We told the vet and he did a blood panel and said everything was fine. Thoughts are appreciated.

    Thanks!

    David

    Moki's Dad

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  • BasenjimammaB

    David, Iam sorry to hear about Moki, I do not know, but it sure does sound like seizures. How many of theses episodes does he have? Are they often, how does he behave afterwards? Is he sore/stiff?

    I know its a lot of questions, but maybe it will help in figuring it out..and I would go have a second opinion done, from a different vet. You've seen the seizures so you know they are happening.

    Petra and Pippin

    with Otis in my heart…

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  • M

    Hi Basenjimamma:

    When they started several months ago, there was a period over a couple of weeks where he did it 10 times a day and then it stopped for a few months and then started again. Very odd. He seems to be completely fine in between episodes. We will probably take him to another vet. One thing that does seem to help is if we give him half a tranquilizer or a Benadryl. Any other comments are appreciated.

    David

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  • thunderbird8588T

    Hi David,
    sorry to hear about Moki, wonder if its an alergy or cramp? It may be an idea to video him to show the vet.
    Our elderly Basenji had seizures, these were full blown falling to the floor type. He had a liver problem and with treatment did ok.
    He did have a few episodes of screaming when getting down from the setee, very occasional . Also he twitched if we opened a crisp packet near him. This was quite a time before the proper seizures started.
    Please keep us posted

    Shelley

    Basenji Malaika

    Basenji Malaika
    Basenji Kwame

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  • M

    Thanks, Shelley. Agree it is a good idea to video an episode but never seem to have the videocam close by when it happens. Will keep trying though. He was quiet all night and so far so good this morning!

    David

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  • thunderbird8588T

    Hi David, hope Moki is doing all right. Just a thought my parents Papillon recently started to lick franticaly at his front paws. After bathing his paws with no sucess they took him to the vets. The vet found a minute cut that was actualy healing.

    Shelley

    Basenji Malaika

    Basenji Malaika
    Basenji Kwame

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  • C

    Humm, David, why don't you suggest to the next vet to have his thyroid checked. I would also suggest some lavendar oil for massage and helping him relax after an eposide, This will mentally calm him down too.
    Keep in touch.

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  • Rita JeanR

    We just happen to meet a lady yesterday who has had 6 basenjis and one of there's when it was older had seizurers. They found out it had fanconi.

    Rita Jean

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  • tanzaT

    Best way to eliminate Fanconi is to strip test. If sugar in the urine, a Vet follow up for blood work is needed asap. If no sugar in the blood, then blood gases are needed.

    Fanconi dogs typically die of something other than Fanconi (if treated early and on the protocol)… but it is the Fanconi that leads the other organs of the body to begin having problems.

    Pat Fragassi

    Tanza Basenjis

    www.tanzabasenjis.net

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  • wizardW

    I would talk to your vet again - and if no satisfaction then try another. Maybe some one on the forum who lives near you can suggest another.

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  • M

    I think we can rule out Fanconi and any kind of actual injury to the paw based symptoms and timing of episodes. We are trying to get one of the episodes recorded to show the vet next time we take him in. The seizures, if that is what they are, are relatively minor compared to what I have read about. He seems very out of it while it is happening but snaps back to normal very quickly, with the exception of following my partner around obsessively (more than usual). One friend suggested it might be caused by diet (preservatives and trace metals). Yesterday, we switched him to all natural dry and wet food so we will see if that helps – although preservatives and metals can build up in the body over time so it may take a while. Thanks again for all the posts. He has has a few episodes over the past few days but they have been relatively minor.

    David (MokiDad)

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  • BasenjimammaB

    David, That sounds like a good idea, to record him while having a seizure. The diet change is good as well, I am a firm believer in diet related illnesses, in humans or pets..feeding him a nmore natural diet is better for him regardless of whether it solves the seizure thing or not. Keep us updated..he is in our thoughts.

    Petra and Pippin

    with Otis in my heart…

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  • BasenjimammaB

    David, That sounds like a good idea, to record him while having a seizure. The diet change is good as well, I am a firm believer in diet related illnesses excisting, in humans or pets..feeding him a more natural diet is better for him regardless of whether it solves the seizure thing or not. Keep us updated..he is in our thoughts.

    Petra and Pippin

    with Otis in my heart…

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  • Rita JeanR

    Keep us all up to date on how your doing. My best to you both and hopes the food will take care of it. Good Luck

    Rita Jean

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  • lvossL

    I only just realized where you live, has he been tested for Valley Fever?

    Here are some of the symptoms of disseminated Valley Fever:
    ? lameness or swelling of limbs
    ? back or neck pain
    ? seizures and other manifestations of central nervous system swelling
    ? soft swellings under the skin that resemble abscesses
    ? swollen lymph nodes under the chin, in front of the shoulder blades, or behind
    the stifles
    ? non-healing skin ulcerations or draining tracts that ooze fluid
    ? eye inflammation with pain or cloudiness

    Here is a link to a full article on Valley Fever, http://www.vfce.arizona.edu/Content/Documents/Valley%20Fever%20in%20Dogs%20for%20PDF.pdf

    I know there is at least one person on the forums that had a dog with disseminated Valley Fever.

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    We actually discussed this article in my Samoyed Genetics group. They looked at the develoment of ketones (which is the basics fundamental way it is supposed to work with diabetics) In animal models, low-carbohydrate, high-protein diets do not produce ketosis or reduce glycemia but rather cause obesity. However, limiting both protein and carbohydrates as in a classic ketogenic diet remarkably reduces blood glucose in animal models of type 1 and type 2 diabetes and reverses diabetic nephropathy. << https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23680948 There are a few Canine Epilepsy support group: https://www.facebook.com/annemorley.21/ http://www.canine-epilepsy.com/ Has a chat room This has been around since 1991: http://www.petsandanimals.co.uk/canine-epilepsy-support-group
  • otisandroarO

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    M
    Yes! Thank you to all for responding to my post as well. The environmental issues are a good one for me to research. We live in south Texas on a peninsula in the Gulf of Mexico, so humidity and high levels of mold are the norm. We've been gutting our house room-by-room over the last 13 years to repair and update it, so there have been a lot of new materials, construction dust, etc. And then our town took the direct hit from Hurricane Harvey, our home was flooded, and we're still not back in it. We've decided to abandon our coastal life and move inland, so those environmental factors will be changing. If our gal's health has been impacted by the home and location, maybe the move will make a difference. I hope it's not too late if that's the case.
  • nobarkusN

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    Okay not to alarm you, but please make sure that what you are seeing is in fact cluster seizures (where there is a definite recovery between seizures) and status seizures, where there is no recovery but continues seizures. Status are the most dangerous… they can and do die from them. So getting this under control fast is critical. A side note, I worked in the UTnK Brain Research and Neuropsychology Lab with Dr Joel Lubar on his epilepsy program. QUOTE:>> The massive muscle activity of the seizures leads to hyperthermia with temperatures as high as 106 degrees Fahrenheit or more, which if sustained, causes irreversible damage to neurons. Hypoxia from inadequate pulmonary ventilation also causes brain damage. Severe lactic acidosis from shock and tissue hypoxia, amplified by excessive muscle activity, probably contributes to neuron deterioration. Death is usually not from brain dysfunction directly, but from overtaxation of cardiopulmonary reserve by the combination of massive continuous exercise, hypoxia, lactic acidosis, shock, and possibly also hyperthermia.<< Below are notes from Feb with a vet friend regarding another friend's chow. He was having seizures and they could not get control. (he mostly likely, however, had a brain tumor, and due to age and advancing loss of quality of life was put down.) NOTES: Hey, yell when you see this: OK, friends - I guess I posted too soon that xxx was doing so well. He had another seizure this morning about 4:00am. ...talked to the vet again and I think I would at least like to TRY some antiseizure medication. The vet talked about phenobarbitol and something called Zonisamide. She said that usually Zonisamide is given if the phenobarbitol isn't working - but that they have started giving it as the first drug some. It does not have the side effects of phenobarbitol because it isn't metabolized in the liver. But she also said it is a fairly new drug and hasn't been widely used. I also read online about Potassium Bromide. BR response:::: KBr is a good option and we have been using Kepra with good results too. I have no experience with Zonisamide Seizures do need to be controlled we have had 3 dogs in the practice in the last year that went into status and cooked themselves.... body temperature skyrockets during the seizure and causes brain damage Zonisamide is in the same class of drugs as Kepra.....we have used it as a first option but most often along with pheno when the pheno isn't working by itself Debra Levey So would you say start with pheno and add kepra if necessary? BR: Depends on liver function.... if ALT is normal then that's what we usually do, mostly because it works quickly (KBR & kepra take a little longer to build a "blood level") If ALT is elevated or borderline then start with kepra or KBR. Milk thistle is a good idea to support liver also<<< That's all I can give you as I have never had a dog with seizures. But if you don't get things under control in a couple of weeks, you might consider a specialist at a university since there could be other issues causing it. I am assuming your vet already did blood work and ruled out any toxins or medication issues.