Neutering is not going to help - training is. But a good trainer will train YOU to deal with the dog. If a trainer can get him to behave but you can't - there is little to be gained from paying out money. This is something you should never have allowed to happen, but since it has, I think you should deal with it and @JENGOSMonkey has given you a good idea to start you off. Withdrawing treats is a good idea, but also, get up and walk away. He could be biting to get attention and therefore you withdraw the attention at the first sign of a bite, with a firm NO.
Aggression ONLY when in trouble…URGENT
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I had a very beloved basenji who had anger issues.
What I found that worked was not a specific training exercise or method but more a mindset change for me. He would behave similarly to your boy– he'd get into something and then flip out. My mentor-breeder and friend told me it sounded like he was very insecure. I thought NOT. I thought he was being very dominant and aggressive. But her words stuck with me and I started changing how I thought about it. I decided to be his haven. I would let myself be the person he could turn to when he was that afraid and insecure.This is counter intuitive. It flies in the face of conventional thinking about dog training and it really flies in the face of the Cesar Milan flavored training that is so popular. I did NOT ever again think I needed to assert my own position. I basically became a comfort and a haven. When he got "in trouble" I emphasized HELPING him get out of trouble. He'd be trapped unde the table flipping out over a pizza crust and I would tell him verbally, "You're ok, Pip. Let me help you." I'd be ready with a valuable treat and tell him to come get it, and when he dropped the troublesome item, I would give him the good treat and hold him. I don't know. It seems namby pamby from the outside but he needed me to protect him from himself. He needed a place to GO when he felt that trapped by whatever that is that makes them act like that. I gave him a place to go and it was me.
(Missing him terribly as I type this.)
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He went through a time when he got crazy about being put into his crate. Same kind of reaction. He would turn into a spitting hissing RATTLESNAKE about it.
In the mode of helping him and of being his haven, I would hold him before putting him to bed for the night, and tell him I knew he did not like this part but I would be back soon. I'd rock him like a baby. It sounds so dopey, but I really felt like he needed to have his feelings acknowledged. And honestly, just acknowledging this solved the whole problem.
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gjrcvw: Im so sorry for the loss of your boy. Im definitely going to consider what you're saying and put it to work. Thank you so much for your advice
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Thank you, Anubis. Best wishes with your little dog.
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When I dog bites hard enough to puncture, you NEED professional help. Failing that, I recently posted nothing in life is free. You need to get to it immediately. Stop raising your voice, but make him work for every single bite that goes in his mouth. No furniture, no bed, his place is his crate.
He doesn't KNOW he's in trouble, he knows you are trying to correct him and his response is PRECISELY what an alpha does to underlings… he bites. You need to have a plastic baseball bat, the soft ones or very light, so that when you tell him to get off the bed or furniture, IN AN EMERGENCY (as in if he rushes you) you can keep him off.
I'm new around here and all, but really, a baseball bat? can we not try something more civilized such as a spray bottle with water? I find a spray bottle works much better than yelling or physical punishment. The dog will not like being sprayed and will retreat.
I would suggest next time the they are doing something "naughty" to use a spray bottle instead of yelling. -
This dog has done damage. A plastic bat won't hurt the dog but it can keep it from hurting the owner. A plastic bat, like little kids use, can keep the dog off, give it something to bite, or swat it away if necessary. This dog wasn't doing something naughty. This dog is attacking the owner. Really huge difference.
And btw, I don't use a spray bottle. I don't think they are abusive, but I also prefer to train right behavior, not use aversion generally. Well that and in my younger days never had one I tried it on who cared.
I work with aggressive dogs and I haven't found one YET who was charging that a spray bottle would do more than make it more mad. But please note I said that's a last recourse and that a professional is always the answer once a dog has done damage.
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I fully understand that the dog was attacking. IMO I feel that a baseball bat of any sort is the wrong way to handle the situation. I also believe that if this problem is not medical related, It is,again IMO, that the problem lies in the fact that the dog does not respect the owner and feels that it can dominate her. If we were talking about a large dog such as a Pitbull I could understand the need for some type of protection. But, we are talking about a Basenji. I was only trying to suggest a method that has worked for me. My feeling towards the situation are that the dog feels that it has the upper hand in the relationship and knows that it can "get away" with it's actions by charging it's owner.
I would suggest that the owner work more with the dog to show them that they are in control and that the behavior is not acceptable. using a spray bottle will catch the dog off guard. and, at the very least, give the owner a chance to react before being bitten. once the owner gets their hands on the dogs collar she can easily hold the dog down to show that she has the upper hand. The dog may resist, but eventually will realize that the owner has more will. She may have to do this a few times but the dog will learn that it can not dominate her. again, this is all IMO! -
once the owner gets their hands on the dogs collar she can easily hold the dog down to show that she has the upper hand. The dog may resist, but eventually will realize that the owner has more will. She may have to do this a few times but the dog will learn that it can not dominate her.
This is not recommended for any basenji I know. This is NOT the way to go.
Btw, I knew gjrcvw's boy (above) and saw her work with him and saw it work. (I loved that boy very much.)
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Let me refresh what I said:
You need to have a plastic baseball bat, the soft ones or very light, so that when you tell him to get off the bed or furniture, IN AN EMERGENCY (as in if he rushes you) you can keep him off.
You act like I suggest the bat to beat the dog. Please reread. Beyond that, we'll have to agree to disagree. I suppose you haven't had a dog charge you, but I'd want more than a water bottle between me and a charging dog. And frankly, the water bottle might or might not work ONCE … probably not the 2nd time unless the dog is really bothered by it. Letting this dog continue to bite is dangerous. You act like a basenji is some fru fru 4 pound chihuahua, it isn't. They can do a lot of damage.
Whether the dog charges due to "forward flight" (ie fear biting) or aggression or because it is dominant, my concern is that the owner NOT GET BITTEN AGAIN.
The owner has had a lot of excellent advice. We'll simply not agree but I'd like you to stop acting like my suggestion was to use the bat to abuse the dog.
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Chairs, etc, are also useful in blocking a true attack. I don't have anything against a plastic bat, honestly; it's quick to grab in an emergency. (Although in an emergency, you're about as likely to grab a magazine rack or a pillow
)I didn't take your suggestion as a form of punishment, Debra, at all.
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Thank you. I mean, I'm the person who says the only use for a rolled up news paper is to hit yourself in the head while repeating "train my dog!"
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Quote:
once the owner gets their hands on the dogs collar she can easily hold the dog down to show that she has the upper hand. The dog may resist, but eventually will realize that the owner has more will. She may have to do this a few times but the dog will learn that it can not dominate her.This is not recommended for any basenji I know. This is NOT the way to go.
Btw, I knew gjrcvw's boy (above) and saw her work with him and saw it work. (I loved that boy very much.)
I was so focused on the bat I missed that.
Alpha rolls, physical domination… that stuff went out with Kohler I hope. Your suggestion will result in 2 scenarios...
1. the dog chew the person badly
2. the issues escalate because physical response is the LAST thing this dog needs.Oy vey.
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Let me refresh what I said:
You act like I suggest the bat to beat the dog. Please reread. Beyond that, we'll have to agree to disagree. I suppose you haven't had a dog charge you, but I'd want more than a water bottle between me and a charging dog. And frankly, the water bottle might or might not work ONCE … probably not the 2nd time unless the dog is really bothered by it. Letting this dog continue to bite is dangerous. You act like a basenji is some fru fru 4 pound chihuahua, it isn't. They can do a lot of damage.
Whether the dog charges due to "forward flight" (ie fear biting) or aggression or because it is dominant, my concern is that the owner NOT GET BITTEN AGAIN.
The owner has had a lot of excellent advice. We'll simply not agree but I'd like you to stop acting like my suggestion was to use the bat to abuse the dog.
I am sorry, I was not intending to sound rude. I was a caught a little off guard with the baseball bat comment, thats all. I had never heard of that method before.
I am in no way a professional dog trainer and was just trying to offer my advise. I do realize you said "only as a last resort" and that you were not implying that she physically hurt the dog.. personally, I do not think I would ever use an object such as a baseball bat, even a soft one. But, I have never been put in that situation. -
Quote:
once the owner gets their hands on the dogs collar she can easily hold the dog down to show that she has the upper hand. The dog may resist, but eventually will realize that the owner has more will. She may have to do this a few times but the dog will learn that it can not dominate her.I was so focused on the bat I missed that.
Alpha rolls, physical domination… that stuff went out with Kohler I hope. Your suggestion will result in 2 scenarios...
1. the dog chew the person badly
2. the issues escalate because physical response is the LAST thing this dog needs.Oy vey.
you must have got the wrong impression of what I was trying to imply…. I realize that physically holding a dog down to the ground will only escalate the situation. I should have worded that differently.
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I guess having seen dogs who are that upset, the probability of the person getting hold of the collar without being bitten is not good.
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It is,again IMO, that the problem lies in the fact that the dog does not respect the owner and feels that it can dominate her. If we were talking about a large dog such as a Pitbull I could understand the need for some type of protection. But, we are talking about a Basenji. I was only trying to suggest a method that has worked for me. My feeling towards the situation are that the dog feels that it has the upper hand in the relationship and knows that it can "get away" with it's actions by charging it's owner.
I would suggest that the owner work more with the dog to show them that they are in control and that the behavior is not acceptable. using a spray bottle will catch the dog off guard. and, at the very least, give the owner a chance to react before being bitten. once the owner gets their hands on the dogs collar she can easily hold the dog down to show that she has the upper hand. The dog may resist, but eventually will realize that the owner has more will. She may have to do this a few times but the dog will learn that it can not dominate her. again, this is all IMO!If I had done this to Pippin, he would have escalated, probably bitten me very severely, and would have been euthanised. Please understand that this method will absolutely not work for all dogs, and especially not for all basenjis. It is dangerous to human and eventually to dog.
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I do understand your point and was only trying to point out that there are other options than a baseball bat. As I stated, we are talking about a dog which weighs aprox. 20lbs. I realize not everyone can defend them self the same. but, a 20lb dog should not be able to over power MOST people..
I am not a dog trainer and am only offering my opinions, Honestly IMO any dog that shows that kind of aggression towards their owner has 1- a serious health issue that could cause said behavior, 2 - lack of proper training. Again, this is just my opinion.
When I was offering my advise I was using a method I had read of in a book and have tried myself. Though, I am providing a link to an article I have just stumbled upon that touches on this very subject…. http://www.pethealthfocus.com/articles/topics/is-cesar-millan-wrong. -
A twenty pound dog can still deliver a Level 3 or 4 bite which is incredibly serious. Deep punctures are high risk for infection not to mention possible damage to muscle, tendons, and ligaments. Telling people that they should try to restrain the dog is putting them at very high risk of serious injury even with a twenty pound dog. My husband very nearly had to be hospitalized due to a puncture wound that became infected even though he did everything right.
Using an object as a physical barrier or restraint is far safer.
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As I stated, I do understand that a dog of any size can do damage. I was only attempting to point out that "I" do not feel a baseball bat is the proper way to handle this situation. I would feel more comfortable recommending a mesh muzzle before I would suggest using an object to "beat" off the dog….. Although a muzzle may not be the ideal solution, I feel that it is far better suggestion than to use a baseball bat on a dog........ For any reason.
A baseball bat imo will only intensify the dogs behavior and not teach the dog that their behavior is unacceptable. -
Debra stated already, the baseball bat is NOT to be used to beat the dog off but to provide a physical barrier so the dog does not connect with human flesh when it charges the owner. You have latched onto one idea and are not reading what others are saying.
Trying to touch or restrain a dog that has entered "fight" mode is a recipe for disaster and advising people that it okay to do it because they are ONLY 20 pound dogs is irresponsible.
