@zande said in Now tht's agood idea!!!!:
I think Ms Lipman actually owns a Basenji ! In fact I am sure she does
Yahh! I agree with you.
Attacked and now aggressive?
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My Lucy was a very loving dog when I got her. She wanted to go up and meet any dog that she came across and would be very friendly. Then over the Fourth of July, a Boxer/Mastiff attacked her. She wasn't seriously injured, and seemed to get over it fairly quickly. She still gets along awesome with my Lab mix, but she now seems aggressive towards new dogs. Instead of just wanting to say Hi, she'll growl, the hair on her back goes up and she'll lunge at other dogs. It's hard for me to take her on walks now. I'm hoping that she'll get over it, but I'm worried. I try getting down at her level and being a medium between her and another dog, but it only helps with dogs bigger than her. If it's smaller than her, she'll try to go over me to get at it. I don't know if she'd really hurt the other dog, but it's one of those situations where I don't want to try it and find out.
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I have two leash reactive dogs. Both have been attacked by other dogs while on leash, both use their voice and body language to give distance increasing signals to dogs that approach or enter their space. I have been able to decrease the space they need in order to feel comfortable. I use methods similar to ones that have been described on this list by other people with leash reactive dogs. It is not uncommon for adult dogs, even ones that have not been attacked to not want other dogs running up and getting in their space, it is rude dog behavior.
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It's not really other dogs running up to her though. When she was attacked, she was on a leash, and the other dog was lose. They were friendly for a while, then the boxer suddenly attacked. My biggest issue right now it I live in an apartment complex. A couple times I've gone to take Lucy out while the guy across from me is taking his dog out. The guy's dog will just be sitting there, but Lucy will try to charge at it. It's weird.
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Three times, dogs not on leashes, have attacked my dog. So now he is ready to go at it with all dogs (except female dogs he remembers as a puppy).
Once a dog is imprinted the behavior several times it is going to be hard to change, especially with a basenji, which carries 'The Who' motto "We Don't Get Fooled Again!"
Try talking to your neighbor about it maybe?
We used to take our male to the 4th of July parade (we stopped as it's too hot for him), anyway some stranger sees our dog and comes running over asking if he was a basenji. We told him he was and goes on telling us of a neighbor that had a basenji. The basenji's neighbor had a German Sheppard you would continually try to go after the basenji. He told us one day the basenji got sick of the German Sheppard and went after him, grabbing on to the German Sheppard by the throat and throwing him to the ground. He said he has never seen such a powerful little dog like that basenji!
He said the German Sheppard never bothered the basenji again after that.I would love to know what to do about it myself!
It reminds me of our son, who we raised never to fight. So in elementary school kids start picking on him and he askd what he should do. We tell him not to fight, but it gets worse, so told him to talk to the teacher, but that does little. So finally we just told him your going to have to fight back. He did, he got in trouble at school, but the kids did not bother him anymore after that. He learned you have to stand up and sometimes your going to have to fight and then NOT TELL on the other kids (nothing worse at school than a snitch)
The point is, with all your dog training and socialization class & rules it all goes down the crapper with incidents like WE have both faced, like this. It's not a perfect world and puppy classes never train you about how to face a loose dog attacking your dog or what to do after it happens.
When our dog was about a year old my wife was walking our dog and he gets attacked by a loose Wheaton terrier. My wife picks our dog up but the Wheaton Terrier knocks my wife over and she fractured her wrist in two places! The terrier then just takes off!
We called the police and made a report, but nothing happened.
Another time on vaction my wife & dog got attacked by a loose golden retriever whom we found out the owner just lets the dog wander around loose!
Luckly the guy whom we rented our cabin from ran over and grabbed the retriever.
Another time my dog was attacked by a female black lab that ran through her invisible fence (she got shocked but kept coming!) My dog and myself just stood our ground and he counter attacked, that shocked the dog- The owner then runs out saying "that's not supposed to happen!
It reminds me of my son, that sometimes your going to have to prepare for an attack and your dog is going to have to fight back to defend it'self. Maybe you can pick your dog up in time but what about you ?
Will the other dog attack you?I don't know, but I'm not about to find out. If it happens again and the dogs not a pit bull, rot or other huge dog, I'm going to drop the leash if we get charged again.
Again any trainers out there tell us what to do in this situation?
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All this crap happens due to irresponsible pet owners, who don't take the time to work with their dogs or pawn off responsibity of watching them with these Invisible fences.
So this takes all our training and socialization and throws it down the crapper.
After all these attacks, then the our dogs have to deal with dogs who do stay in their invisable fences, but hide, then come charging full speed out at your dogs with the owners are not anywhere around, stopping at their invisble fence lines about 2' away from the sidewalk, running snapping & barking at your dogs while you walk by.
How do you condition your dog from this and the real attacks?
Then on a walk another dog on a leash approachs and the dogs go pycho and the owner looks at you like "whats wrong with your dogs?"
The more things like invisible fences the more people feel they can just let their dogs be unsupervised.
I've really had it with this !!!
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It's not really other dogs running up to her though. When she was attacked, she was on a leash, and the other dog was lose. They were friendly for a while, then the boxer suddenly attacked. My biggest issue right now it I live in an apartment complex. A couple times I've gone to take Lucy out while the guy across from me is taking his dog out. The guy's dog will just be sitting there, but Lucy will try to charge at it. It's weird.
What I have done is carry treats with me on walks. When I see another dog or if mine see it first I give them a treat to redirect their attention towards me. I keep giving treats until the other dog has passed or we have gotten past the other dog. At first, I usually have to use some really high value treats like roast chicken and sometimes it is still hard to keep their attention but they do start to learn that seeing another dog means treats are coming so seeing another dog is not a bad thing. Seeing a dog starts to mean look at me so they can get a treat. After an attack my dogs are not comfortable even seeing a dog especially a loose one even all the way across the park. So I know that I need to be giving treats and moving away as soon as we spot a dog. With time and work my dogs have gotten to be pretty non-reactive as long as other dogs are about leash length away with a couple of exceptions, dogs moving straight towards us and loose dogs. We have set backs but we work through them.
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DITTO on the above…I have the same situation!
I think you may have re-condition Lucy to tolerate other dogs at a distance (meaning no lunging or growling at other dogs). She may not ever be as friendly as she used to be but she should be able to tolerate other dogs at a distance without lunging and growling.
Working with her every day will be key...teaching "Watch" and slowing decreasing the space between Lucy & the other dog until she can just relax when she sees another dog. This will only work if she begins to trust that you won't allow another dog near so she doesn't have to defend herself.
You have to convince her that you will protect her & you will not allow another dog to attack her again. If she trusts you as her leader then she'll eventually learn to be less reactive.
I have two crazy dogs
and their reactions are few & far between but a whole lot less then before. Now they look for me...it's as if they're saying "Hey mom you see that dog! You see him right!" And I HAVE to respond "yes I see him & I'm calm & in control & you have nothing to worry about. If you sit here next to me I"ll give you a treat & you'll be just fine"I recommend you use the book..Fiesty Fido by Patricia Mcconnell it's pretty inexpensive & a very short read almost like a manual & how to deal with EXACTLY this situation.
It will take lots of work but it's worth it in the end. Good Luck!
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It's not really other dogs running up to her though. When she was attacked, she was on a leash, and the other dog was lose. They were friendly for a while, then the boxer suddenly attacked. My biggest issue right now it I live in an apartment complex. A couple times I've gone to take Lucy out while the guy across from me is taking his dog out. The guy's dog will just be sitting there, but Lucy will try to charge at it. It's weird.
I would take super great treats (pork chops) - treats of high value on your walks. Use them to distract Lucy's interest in other dogs. And of course give her treats for walking nice. Practice basic training commands in conjunction with distraction during your walks especially when you spy other dogs. Stay calm and upbeat/happy. (Dogs pick up on their humans anxiety thru the leash and voice) You want to condition Lucy to associate your walks with fun, instead of gearing up for war.
It's too bad about the attacking boxer. I do not let my dogs get close to strange dogs. No problem with dogs I know they've already had introductions. I don't want strangers petting my dogs and don't encourage my son to go up an pet other dogs either. I just like being on the safe side.
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The point is, with all your dog training and socialization class & rules it all goes down the crapper with incidents like WE have both faced, like this. It's not a perfect world and puppy classes never train you about how to face a loose dog attacking your dog or what to do after it happens.
I would have to argue that this is really dependent on your instructor and class. I go to the instructor that I do specifically because she incorporates lots of strategies to help with reactive dogs. There are classes that have been mentioned on this forum that deal specifically with reactive dogs.
My oldest boy Nicky has been attacked several times for the first 5 years it was at least once every year. Nicky is in some ways very much like Eyeore, if a bad thing happens to him then he tends to think it will happen to him again. He loves going for walks but the sight of other dogs made him anxious and he was very reactive. He wanted to make it clear to the other dogs to stay away. He is a much more relaxed dog now and I credit training for that. I found the trainer that I use a little over 2 years ago. She is a postive reinforcement trainer, has owned several breeds and appreciates the unique qualities that each breed has. Her classes focus on basic manners and the techniques she uses has given me great tools to help my dogs after and attack. She also does give people suggestions for dealing with loose dogs and lots of other situations that people may have.
If your training class is not meeting your needs then maybe you should see if there is one in your area that will.
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True our classes focused on the basics like sit, stay, ect. Never once did they train you what to do if your dogs is attacked and afterword what to do.
What you do when you have another agressive do that lives near you that you have to constantly encounter?
I don't know if carrying treats is going to help in that situation.
You can only avoid another dog so often.
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Why do you "have" to encounter it?
I know when most people in my neighborhood walk their dogs and what routes so I usually don't encounter dogs that would be a problem. Sometimes people changes their routine but I just change my route to avoid a confrontation. There are also routes that I won't walk because of the dogs that live on it and the owners.
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Because they are everywhere I go where I live. I swear I have dogs on invisible fences, you cross the street, then you got another person walking their dog on your side so you have to choose. It does not happen all the time, but it happens enough, to me.
1. My house
2. next door neighbor with dog that they let loose in frnt yard to go to the bathroom everyday! She came running up to my dog and twice my dog grabbere her by the throat and flipped her on her back. She does not bother him anymore, but still I can't go that way if the dog is out.3. A path that leads to the neighborhood behind me, the that house has two huge Alaskian Mals that absolutely freak when they see my dogs, they want to tear my dogs apart, I don't want trouble, so I avoid them if they are out. They are at least on leashes with owners.
4. House on the corner with invisible fence, the owners are never around and they have two little mop dogs that come charging out at our dogs, sometimes the surprise you and come out of no where.
5. Cul-de-sac where the black lab that went through invisible fence attacked us. I don't even go there after that.
6.Cul-de-sac neighbor with wippet that they let loose in front yard off leash.
7. Huge crippled Lab male that the owners loose all the time. He hobbles around and charges strange dogs, but is friendly. Still I don't like dogs running up to us.
What do you suggest I do?
What I normally do is walk them at times when most owners are not out, like 6:00 AM or at dinner time. Still I have to run the gaunlet everyday.
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This sounds like you need an animal shelter bus to come out to your place and offer free shots or some kind of social gathering where the county can express your concerns by telling them the leash laws without including you.
I suggest training with other dogs because it is a controlled atmosphere where you are socializing your basenji with other pets.
Another option would be to pay a trainer to come to your house and work with you on your regular daily walk. Things to look for, best way to address situations etc.
I am sure that you will find the best solution, and restricting your walks isnt right. You should not stop doing something just because other people are inconsiderate.
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It was great when our breeder lived here in Chicago. She would come out and we would do dog training just like what you stated. What was best about her, she understood the breed. She them moved to New Mexico.
Maybe I should call that new Australian dog training service that comes to your home a guarantees results in a two hour period.
http://www.barkbusters.co.nz/inhome.htm
Has anyone heard anything about them? -
Because they are everywhere I go where I live. I swear I have dogs on invisible fences, you cross the street, then you got another person walking their dog on your side so you have to choose. It does not happen all the time, but it happens enough, to me.
1. My house
2. next door neighbor with dog that they let loose in frnt yard to go to the bathroom everyday! She came running up to my dog and twice my dog grabbere her by the throat and flipped her on her back. She does not bother him anymore, but still I can't go that way if the dog is out.6.Cul-de-sac neighbor with wippet that they let loose in front yard off leash.
7. Huge crippled Lab male that the owners loose all the time. He hobbles around and charges strange dogs, but is friendly. Still I don't like dogs running up to us.
What do you suggest I do?
Mantis had some good ideas. Also, start reporting the loose dogs, every time they are out loose. You should be able to walk your dogs without having to worry about being charged and attacked by dogs that are in violation of the leash law, whether you have a dog with you or not. Looking at your diagram, getting rid of the loose dogs in your neighborhood would actually make it a lot easier to avoid the other problem houses. You can cross the street so you are on the opposite side from the houses with invisible fence and continue to avoid the house with the lab that is willing to cross the invisible fence.
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To avoid loose dogs in the neighborhood, I take my dogs to walk in parks that have strictly enforced leash laws, and lots of rangers.
For those that are seriously interested in changing a reactive dogs behavior (meaning lots of work, not just words) I recommend "Click to Calm" by Emma Parsons, and/or a trainer that has read, and follows these type training steps/methods. Fiesty Fido (that jys mentioned is great too).
I do not recommend the mentioned Australian dog training chain for Basenjis. For one thing, they won't tell you what methods they use until you schedule (and pay for) a consultation with them. For another thing, they lots of techniques that are not positive reinforcement.
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Also, start reporting the loose dogs, every time they are out loose.
Believe me I would love to call the cops on my next door neighbor, with their two dogs that also go to the bathroom in our front yard. The hard part comes with fear of their teenage son's reprisals (has little morals and has been in big trouble before) and starting a "war" with my neighbor. which I have had to deal with bad neighbors before and things just escalate. I really don't want to go down that war path.
I have another neighbor down the street who had a great dane who she walked out in her front yard on a leash for the dog to go to the bathroom. The bad part is she never picked it up. It was disgusting. Someone must have called about them because they no longer do that or the dog died?
I would be calling the cops on half the people on my street!
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I do not recommend the mentioned Australian dog training chain for Basenjis. For one thing, they won't tell you what methods they use until you schedule (and pay for) a consultation with them. For another thing, they lots of techniques that are not positive reinforcement.
Yeah I know negative punishment only leads to either escalating aggression or you break the animal's spirit. Basenjis are really delicate animals to deal with and not many trainers understand they do not respond to discipline.
I have gone over the edge (not physical punishment) with my dog where I took away most of his privlidges and it broke his spirit. He became mopey and mean. Positive training & consistancy has made him a great dog, although he still needs work from time to time.
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Believe me I would love to call the cops on my next door neighbor, with their two dogs that also go to the bathroom in our front yard. The hard part comes with fear of their teenage son's reprisals (has little morals and has been in big trouble before) and starting a "war" with my neighbor. which I have had to deal with bad neighbors before and things just escalate. I really don't want to go down that war path.
I would be calling the cops on half the people on my street!
You should see if you can report anonymously. If no one is willing to report those who break these laws then people will continue to break them. You are likely not the only person who is unhappy about what is going on in neighborhood.
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Actually the worst part is their son's car!
He has his rear of his truck filled with subwoofers and sits in the driveway blasting them. One day a nieghbor down the block came all they way over to yell at him to turn it off.
My son used to play with him when they were younger until he did something so bad had to be sent away for a while (because he was a kid he could not face criminal charges). He's the type of kid that you would read about snapping and doing something horrible. I do not want to light that fuse. He's adopted and his parents are older and don't have a clue about raising a kid.
He just graduated high school and hopefully, will be going away to collage and getting out of our lives.
