Posts made by Sanda Saunders

OMG I wonder if the SAFANDO talked about in the article could be this African Wild Dog
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lycaon_pictus
Go look at the map of where it lives. It does overlap known basenji territories.
What if… what if....
We need John Curby to do a DNA annalysis to see if any possible genetic input could have come from there????
(He is the only guy I know of who would be capable and pehaps interested.)
In the article it mentions people crossing them with local dogs.
Sooo interesting.....
Sanda

http://www.basenji.org/african/macd6709.htm
There is a good part on the lion hunting in this article…. sooooooo good!!!!

Interesting part about a possible brindle connection in there too, towards the end.

@nomrbddgs:

Hopefully next Sept at the next Regional you put on? It was really good. And so much info from everyone and a wonderful slide show from Father Titus on Basenji info.

Yes The BCOC Regional Specialty should be at the same place same time "ish". The last Saturday of August. August 31st 2013
Yes I will try to get part B of the Father Titus presentation. So much we never got to present. I will work on it with him all next spring and summer.
I will make sure to weed out any unimportant info. As too much is not the best. Just keep the most interesting and most relevant. We will have loads of fun too!

@nomrbddgs:

Nice to hear you speak up Sanda! Your memory is much better than mine, but the establishment was quite noisy as well. I heard 'lion' and 'kill' in the same sentence. So technically, when threatened Father Titus did say they would kill a lion if needed.

Yes we had information overload!!! Yes he did say they could kill a lion as a pack if need be but that is rare. Usually they scare the predators away. It is very hard to beleive that small dogs like that could kill a lion. I will ask him for more info about this topic. Next time he goes to the Congo, he will gather more stories on this topic and share them with us. I will ask him to video interview people. We can all watch it together. It will be so much fun!!!

Just to make a small but important clarification. Usually Basenjis did not kill the lions. They surounded the lions and the humans did the killing. So the Basenji is not really a lion killer. However Father Titus did hear of stories about packs of Basenjis having killed lions. But it would be very rare. For those who are curious. Father Titus is my parish priest here on Base Petawawa, Ontario, Canada. He was born and raised in the Congo. His grandfather, who hunted with a basenji, was the cheif of a village. This village still does not have power. People still live in huts. He also mentioned that often Basenjis would scare the lions and other predators away from the encampments. Basenji packs would always protect their humans through intimidation. Often scaring lions away!!! This for thousands of years. He also mentioned that the Basenji in Congo is in danger due to a rabies epidemic and some waring tribes using them for food. So the Basenji is not really a lion killer however it is a lion scarer. Absolutely! A pack of Basenjis will take on anything that threatens their humans. Heck yah!!!

@sharronhurlbut:

Kay, can you tell us about the health testing on these b's please.

I updated health testing on parents in the ad.:):)

@curlytails:

I believe there's a mandatory form that you need to follow when posting basenjis for sale on this site. Check out the sticky at the top of this category here:
http://www.basenjiforums.com/showthread.php?t=125

You must title your post with your City and State
Example For Sale: Basenji boy(s) For Sale in Jersey City, NJ/NY/PA

–-----------------
Your name:
Your city, state:
Your phone numbers/email:
Basenji(s) For Sale:
Age of Basenji(s):
Current weight of Basenji(s) for sale:
Weight of Basenji(s) parents:
Parents health tests:
Registration if any (AKC, Basenji Clubs, etc):
Price:
Age when puppies will be ready to be taken home:
Do you ship your Basenjis:

Ok I have updated the ad to follow the format.

Basenji girl For Sale in Petawawa, Ontario, Canada

–-----------------
Your name: Sanda Saunders
Your city, state: Petawawa, Ontario, Canada
Your phone numbers/email: sandasaunders@gmail.com
Basenji(s) For Sale: Africanadian Kay Of AhmahrNahr
Age of Basenji(s): 7 months old (born dec 22nd 2010)
Current weight of Basenji(s) for sale: 22 lbs
Weight of Basenji(s) parents: 22 lbs
Parents health tests: both fanconi clear, mom has clear eyes, dad has minor ppm, hips are fair.
Registration if any (AKC, Basenji Clubs, etc): ckc registered name: Africanadian Kay Of AhmahrNahr
Price: $1000
Age when puppies will be ready to be taken home: 7 months old so she is ready now
Do you ship your Basenjis: yes

Sweet, cuddly and loving Basenji female puppy for sale to loving forever home. She was raised with 3 kids and shown by a 10 year old girl. She never barks, never sheds as long as you condition her coat once every 2 weeks, does not require grooming other then her nails. I would consider placing this show quality 7 months old Basenji female puppy in a pet only home. So this means you don't need to show her or breed her. If you ever change your mind we can make arrangements privately. But otherwise, you can have her as a pet only with no strings attached.

Her name is Kay. There is no problem with her at all. She is crate trained and leash trained. She does not climb fences like some Basenjis do. We did show her about 9 times so she has nice manners. She has lovely temperament. Her mom is a World Champion and her dad is a Best In Speciality Show. So you are getting top quality. Both parents are health tested up the ying yang. Both parents are Fanconi clear.

I have kept 3 females out of my last litter and one has to go. I need the money to pay for the costs of showing the others. So if you like this sweet basenji girl, you can bring her home.

Breed info: The Basenji is a breed of hunting dog that was bred from stock originating in central Africa. They were used in the Congo jungle by the Pygme tribes for hunting. The word Basenji means "bush thing". Basenjis first appeared in Egyptian hieroglyphics about 5,000 years ago. In 1895, Europeans came across Basenjis in the Congo. Basenjis were prized by locals for their intelligence, courage, speed, and silence. They were assistants to the hunt, wearing large bells around their necks and chasing wild game into nets for their masters.
Basenjis were brought to England in the 1930s. In 1941, Basenjis were brought to America, and were officially accepted into the American Kennel Club in 1943. Today, the Basenji can still be found working in Africa. First litter in Canada was born in November 1940 between Kikuyu of the Congo & Koodoo of the Congo under the kennel name Windrush.

The Basenji produces an unusual yodel-like sound commonly called a "barroo", due to its unusually shaped throat. This trait also gives the Basenji the nickname "Barkless Dog Of Africa".

Basenjis share many unique traits with the wild dogs of Australia called: dingos. They both come into heat only once a year, as compared to other dog breeds which have two breeding seasons every year. Both dingos and Basenjis lack a distinctive odor and are prone to howls, yodels, and other vocalizations over the characteristic bark of modern dog breeds. One theory holds that the latter trait is the result of the selective killing of barkier dogs in the traditional Central African context because barking could lead enemies to humans' forest encampments. While dogs that resemble the basenji in some respects are commonplace over much of Africa, the breed's original foundation stock came from the old growth forest regions of the Congo Basin, where its structure and type were fixed by adaptation to its habitat, as well as use (primarily net hunting in extremely dense old-growth forest vegetation).

The Basenji is alert, affectionate, energetic, curious and reserved with strangers. The Basenji is somewhat aloof, but can also form strong bonds with people. It is commonly patient. Basenjis dislike wet weather, like to climb, can easily get over chain wire fences, and are very clever at getting their own way. The Basenji has the unique properties of not barking (it makes a low, liquid ululation instead) and cleaning itself like a cat. It can be described as speedy, frisky, tireless at play, and teasing the owner into play. Basenjis reveal their animal-of-prey nature by chasing after fast moving objects that cross their paths.

I bred these amazing red and white Basenji puppy dogs out of a World Champion female and a BISS (Best In Speciality Show) male and they are too nice to sell as pet only so I want to show them all this comming summer in Canada and get Canadian Championship on all 4 of them. However, I can not afford the entry fees on all of them for the whole summer, so I am looking for a partner who would be willing to cover the showing expenses on one of them in exchange for half ownership of the dog. The dog can live with me or with you. It can be bred later on or not, that can be discussed privately. For more info contact Sanda Saunders at Africanadian Basenjis sandasaunders@gmail.com Both parents are Fanconi clear and these pups will get tested for everything before they are bred if they are bred. Obviously it all depends on how they grow. But so far the 4 of them are very nice and have a lot to offer.

Only available to a small breeding programm where the dogs live in the house as part of your family. Would consider shipping world wide as long as you can provide references as to your breeding practices and health testing practices.

Here is a link for Johnny
http://www.basenji.org/BasenjiU/Owner/103History/Honor/SD/ZindikasJohnnyComeGreatly.pdf

@Quercus:

Okay, I will bite…my criteria in answering this question is purely typey looking show basenjis, who I have seen in person...nothing else. I didn't include dogs from the past, because I don't really know enough about them only seeing still photos...but there are some that would definitely fall into my 'best ever' category.

Johnny - Ch. Zindika's Johnny Come Greatly
Nate - Ch. Akuaba's Tornado
Simba - Ch. Reveille Bouteniere (however you spell that!)

Yes, they are all big winning dogs...and IMO they deserve to be...yes, they all had flaws....but all dogs do. Each was so typey and so stunning, that they are among my all time top favorites.

@tanza:

I would have to put Ch Kazor's Dandy Deerstalker on that list of exceptional Basenjis. He was a bit to the big size, but was a lovely dog and had llovely offspring (Grand/Greatgrand/Great,Greatgrand offspring) that are still producing today. QUOTE]

Here is a link to Kazors Dandy Deerstalker so you can see what he looks like
http://www.basenji.org/BasenjiU/Owner/103History/Honor/SD/KazorsDandyDeerstalker.pdf

@Elscodobermann:

Thanks for the responses so far - its really interesting to find out who (in the opinion of others ) really significant dogs were - and of course it doesnt meant to say they had to be the top winners - it could be ones who improved the breed in certain desirable features etc.

I just loved this thread!!!! I am also trying to get a grip on the different lines and what they have to offer. Yes registered names are very important to those of us who would not know the call names. Thank you for sharing info about bitches who had important legacies. Since a lot of genetic studies are pointing at the females having a greater impact than males, it is even more important to discuss GREAT females.

I am "stalking" not just great winning conformation lines but also great health lines, great temperament lines, great trainability lines and movement lines.

Would love to hear from Europe and Australia on this topic.

I would like to mention a US dog named CH Astarte Osiris who had excellent hips, temperament, trainability, movement and conformation. I was told he won the Show Of Shows in Mexico City a long time ago. He has a lovely legacy.

I agree that we should never get "winning" obsessed in our choices. A great match might be less campaigned so less notorious or famous but produce a Speciality Winner!!!!!

I feel that those of us who can show could help those who can't for some reason. This way many great dogs could come out of hiding and the Global Basenji Genetic Pool would benefit from it. If we all helped eachother, the breed would benefit from it.

@Nemo:

She could use AI to breed to a stud dog which is not geographically close to her. That way she would have a much larger range of options to choose from and wouldn't have to travel.

Yes actually I did think about that. It is a great idea. There were a few studs I was personally interested in, though and they were not available for shipped seemen but eventually more will become available. Great option though.

@lvoss:

I would also be very concerned about someone looking to buy a stud dog to use on their bitches because they are unwilling to travel to a stud dog. It is bad for the breed as a whole to have lots of puppies produced with the same or similar pedigree. It is also not good breeding practice to use a stud out of convenience rather than because he is a good match for the bitch. Since it sounds like both the girls in this home are closely related, breeding them both to the same stud doesn't really help move a breeding program forward, it just makes for convenient production of puppies.

She just has separation anxiety and is afraid to let her girls go. She is not a bad person. This person has a big heart and cares about her dogs. She will find the RIGHT stud and it will be the healthiest best quality we can find and it will match towards improvement and betterment before anything is done. She is NOT planing to produce many puppies. Very very small scale. Over time she might get used to the idea of sending the bitch out. But for now she just has separation issues.

@tanza:

Totally correct Nemo…. the vertical pedigree is way more important......

I agree with you the most relatives who have A+ health the better.

@Nemo:

I commend your desire to have A+ health for your dogs, but I'm not sure if the focus should be so much on whether the stud you use is rated Excellent if you want to get a better chance of good hips in breeding a Fair-rated bitch. From some discussions I've heard around breeding philosophy, the vertical pedigree is also important to consider, not just the horizontal. What are her sibs hip ratings? Using a stud that has a Good hip rating with a decent number of full/half sibs with good/excellent ratings would likely provide better odds for getting good hips than an Excellent rated dog that has full/half sibs with more fair/good ratings. Granted, it is probably harder to get vertical pedigree data but it is definitely important to consider.

Yes I agree and I am looking into this. I did mention I was looking for relatives with good or excellent hips. Yes I do understand this. I hope someone out there might have some recomendations.

@DebraDownSouth:

You say you have other dogs… care to share their registered names? You were asked this before, on the "Can anyone recommend" thread, yet never responded.

Not sure why you wouldn't research blood lines, decide on a few breeders, have your name on a list and wait to get the line you want.

And why is "excellent" hips so critical? Good and even fair have as good of chance of having clear hip pups as long as their LITTER MATES are also mostly clear. Are your bitches clear? You cannot, you know, compensate for bad hips with good ones.

I am also curious that you said new, not quite a year ago, when you posted you had one and a new litter. Is the 2nd one of those pups?
NEW TO BASENJIS
http://www.basenjiforums.com/showthread.php?t=8703

I have my WW bitch Ahmahr Nahr Just Call Me Madam and 4 of her daughters. One from last year with WW Ahmahr Nahr Jake Jamuel To Mibre. 3 from this year with BISS BIS Sonbar Sonic Shockwave RA. All my girls are fanconi clear. I would prefer to stay with a clear male (just personal preference).

I want excellent hips because Madam is fair so it is very important to me to go towards producing excellent hips in the future. I want to strive to find a stud prospect who will come from stock that is A+ healthwise all around so I can improve on what I have. I want to go towards producing A+ everything, not just good if I can help it. There is nothing wrong with good. Good is great!!!! I just want to stick to A+ instead of A if I can help it. I do realise it is hard to find but I want to give it a try. If I don't find anything I will just convince her to go the the excellent all around male I found.

I understand about going on a waiting list. I am doing my personal research don't worry and I am not in a rush. I pretty much already found a stud to use in the near future that is A+ all around. I am still keeping my eyes open though to all possible options.

However my co-owner wants to have a male at her house because she does not like to send her females out anywhere. So I thought I would help her find something nice to hold-on to. If it is nice enough I might use it in the future. But I am doing this mostly for her right now.

She keeps finding her own but they are not of the quality she should get so I am trying to knock some sense into her and tell her to waite and let me help her find something REALLY nice all around. I am also trying to prevent her from making a mistake and buy something she might regret.

So again I know all about the fact that going on a waiting list is a great thing but I thought I might try to see if anyone from the global village might have something promissing first. If you don't try you will never know.

Health and type is more important to me than a specific bloodline at this point. I don't mind outcrossing to something of a certain type I am trying to set.

My co-owner on a puppy I bred really wants to own or co-own a top quality Fanconi clear show prospect male to hopefully special and breed later on if everything turns out A+. She wants a tri, brindle or black. Sorry we love reds but we have red females. We would like to take this pup/dog to the Canadian Nationals this summer. So we are looking for A+. Parents must have excellent hips (one of them could have good, that's fine) and come from healthy stock all the way around. We are willing to look all around the world for an individual who posesses superior health genes, conformation and temperament.

We also are looking for an exquisite top line and a lot of shelf and second thigh so if you know of anyone that might have a show quality pup available of that style of dog please let me know. Would be willing to take pup or adult and would be willing to share.

I have been looking all over the place for breeders who have excellent hips and A+ everything but it is very hard to find an available pup by now. I do realise most pups are spoken for by now however, if someone kept a show prospect they might be willing to share, it might work out.

I am putting the word out just in case someone is hiding something somewhere on this planet.

The dog/pup would live with 2 females and that's it for the rest of his life. My co-owner even lets them cuddle-up at night in her bed. He would be shown by us together. Hopefully specialed. She is located in Montreal, Canada but again we are willing to import worldwide.:rolleyes:

All I want for Christmass is not my 2 front teeth, it's lots of shelf and lots of second thigh!!! Thank you for all your free advice. I have a very clear picture of the type I am trying to set. Now I know how to describe it accurately. Back to "stalking" bloodlines with that particular type. In the long run I want to get involved with lure coursing and this type with lots of shelf and second thigh will be well suited to it. As well as attractive movement and looks in the conformation ring!!!! Just have to make sure I keep the temperament and health A+ and we are good to go.

I really loved that bitch from Australia, http://www.afrikenji.com/leeloo.html good job guys! I had heard good things about many Australian breeding programs and this confirms it.

@saba:

Her owner and breeder, Helen, and I have had discussions about the shelf a few times now, and she is of the belief that we are beginning to lost the correct shelf in dogs all over the world. It is something that she is justifiably proud of, in her dogs :).

This is why I feel we need cooperation between all the breeders worldwide. The breed needs cooperation to strive, grow and improve (while keeping the desired positive characteristics) .