Thanks everyone. I wasn't worried just not a B noise I was familiar with and wondered if anyone else's pups made this noise. My first female B snored loud enough to wake the dead at four months but not this odd little noise. It's quite handy as I know exactly when she's down for sleep.

Heard her first barooo last Saturday welcoming us home from the Saturday market. And she experienced her first earthquake this morning. OY!

@zande said in Spay Early or Spay Later:

Six months is far too young.

Yes...

Thanks, everyone, for weighing in on the side of waiting. I had a nice long WhatsApp chat with Liz McCargo of Bellator Basenji's last night and even though I did not buy my pup from her, she took the time to share her thoughts, which she said I could share here. This was her original answer.

“For the most part, I recommend delayed spaying and neutering in nearly all cases. For my puppy buyers I recommend waiting until 12-18 months old at the very least, ideally around 24 months old. For a majority of cases, this is best and best for the dogs. Although it means a little more management for the owners, it’s better in the long run for the lifetime of the dog.

“The best resource regarding spaying/neutering is the spay neuter booklet from puppy culture. It goes into all the nuances of why, from a scientific standpoint, and explains things a ton better than I ever could. What it boils down to is it’s better physically, emotionally, mentally, and psychologically for dogs to be allowed to fully mature before removing their sexual organs.

“The sexual organs help regulate the endocrine system which controls growth of joints, bones, organs, and the regulation of the thyroid. This is why many pets become fat after being fixed, the thyroid is negatively impacted by altering pets, and weight control becomes a bit more difficult. So with earlier spay/neuter, a dog can essentially grow disproportionately to what it was genetically designed since early removal of the sexual organs alters the dog genetically.

“So physically you may see no difference but their organs may be smaller or larger than originally designed which may lead to complications in the long run. So your dog may live to 10-12 years old, but had the potential to live to 15. We never really know the full impact as we cannot see into the future. Delayed altering can also reduce risks of many different types of cancers. The issues cited that support altering your pet are still there once you alter at a later age, so you’re not missing out on any of the benefits by waiting, but adding to the ultimate life long benefits by waiting.

“As long as a family can reasonably and responsibly contain their female when in season and contain their male apart from females in season, there’s no need for early altering. Many vets push it because it came from an era of pets breeding at their own will and resulted in many unwanted litters. In today’s day and of age of more fences and less farms, I don’t know any responsible owners who have unwanted litters.

“Most of Europe doesn’t alter their pets ever, but are able to responsibly contain them and prevent unwanted breedings. Anyway, that’s my two cents on it, the puppy culture book is a wealth of knowledge and the more educated you are, the better a standing up to pushy veterinarians.”

https://shoppuppyculture.com/products/puppy-culture-spay-neuter-booklet

So a) I will be buying the puppy culture booklet and b) will do everything in my power to keep my girl from being spayed until she is at least a year old and preferably two. Where I live is rampant with unneutered mutts but I have a secure house for her and am with her 100% of the time, so...we should do fine.

My other two Bs (littermates) were neutered younger than a year. One died of lymphoma at age 9 and the other of a brain tumor at age 10. Not sure if it was the early neutering, disreputable breeder, or what, but I really want to do everything I can to give this little girl the longest and best life possible.

@zande said in Extra Long Heat in Young Unbred Basenji:

Dogs don't have to be registered by their national authority, be it AKC, KC, CKC, RKF, KUSA or any other - to be in the database. The intention of the database is to show a history of the Basenji. This is why I encourage 'fun' photos as an alternative to show poses.

Well then, count me in when I get a chance to come up for air. Flying with Feebs (in the cabin) on Monday from Costa Rica to the USA. Once we get settled I'll find your link again and add her name and lineage.

Thanks again for all your comments and support. Big help and we can all use help getting through puberty. Wish I'd had a support group when I was doing it.

@debradownsouth Hi and thanks for your comment. so confusing as to what to do. The breeder said her dogs are in heat for three weeks. But her dogs are bitches who've been bred... I hear you about the pyometra. Another person said this was particularly an issue with bitches that had "split heats." Your concerns are definitely worth considering...I'll have to think about what to do but probably won't spay until she is 21/2 or 3. I gather from most Basenji breeders this is the age of full maturity.

@zande @DonC Hi again. Definitely waiting until Feebs is at least 2 ½ and now that you say 3, three and maybe not then either. I am the one who posted about the conversation I had with the owner of Bellator Basenjis about waiting to spay/ neuter. In fact, I bought the Puppy Culture book on the subject.

As Phoebe has gone through this heat cycle, her first (six weeks and I think we are finally tapering off, BTW) I can SEE physical changes in her muscle mass. And that's just what I can visualize. I'm sure there is all manner of joint, tendon, and organ maturity going on as well. So, not to worry...I only mentioned the spaying because she can't be registered without doing that. So...she may never be registered. I do have all her linage for the database, though...

Yes, I think she is tapering off... we are at six weeks (yesterday) and down to a minimal of rose-tinted discharge. the swelling has gone way down as well, so...I think we are in the final stretch. Next time I'm definitely buying her britches.

Thank you so much for all your sage advice and supportive voices. Love this group!

@zande Nice. I'm flat out with an international move but when I come up for air, Feeb is neutered ( a requirement by the breeder,) and subsequently registered, I'll definitely fill this out. I'm trying to hold out until she is two...at least to spay her...

@zande I don't know what that is so... probably not. What is it?

@zande OMG, what an idiot vet! And... refused to educate himself. My vet is curious and that is a good thing. I have talked with her a lot about Basenjis, about single heat cycles, coming into heat earlier than the local mutts here, and she is receptive. She just knows she'll never care for another other than mine. I'll let you know how things go this week. I can tell you that Miss Phoebe looked at her food this morning and then at me as if to say, Really? Green beans and kibble? This is what it''s come to between us?

@donc Thanks again. I will cut those two items from her diet for the moment and see if I can dry her up that way. Yes, I've kept a record of her cycle in my journal just because I wanted to track it. She seems fine otherwise and I'll keep you posted. Such a great resource you all are here on BF. Especially since I live in a remote area without Basenji savvy vets!

@zande Hi. Thank you, Sally. I did see a post from you several years ago that indicated you've had bitches with long heat cycles and thank you for weighing in again here. Very helpful. Yes, the vet is an issue where I live (end of the road in very rural Costa Rica) and they know nothing about Basenjis. In the meantime, I'll follow Don's advice and see if I can dry her up with reduced dairy and meat. I'll keep you posted.

@donc Thanks for this info! Yogurt, she does get a dab of yogurt with her combined raw meat and Nutri-source small and medium breed puppy kibbles twice a day. Do you suggest cutting out the meat and yogurt?

I searched the site and found a couple of answers but none that covered my situation (or none that I found anyway). Here's the deal:

Phoebe started bleeding bright red blood that dripped off her hind legs on August 13, 2019. She was 7 months old. I've been keeping close tabs on her since. There was a slowing of the bleeding (sort of pink-tinged liquid) around week three and then she went back to bleeding pretty prolifically, bright red droplets. Her vulva is swollen, but aside from the bleeding she is her normal self.

My question: We are in week six as of yesterday and counting. How long will a young unbred Basenji stay in heat or should I be concerned that something else is going on? Signed, Lady Macbeth.